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Posted by: Charles Deutsch Oct 21 2003, 10:15 AM

So far, the whole DaimlerChrysler thing hasn't been working out too well http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=568&ncid=749&e=1&u=/nm/20031021/bs_nm/autos_daimlerchrysler_dc . I, personally, never understood why a premium, German, luxury automaker would buy the company that brought us the K-car. IMO, Mercedes should dump Chrysler the same way BMW dumped money-bleeding Rover.

Posted by: jonwatts Oct 21 2003, 10:29 AM

I hear they're bringing back the K-car.

Motto: Moving the Master Race into the 21st Century

Posted by: Charles Deutsch Oct 21 2003, 10:51 AM

http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2003-10-07-mercedes_x.htm

Publicly, Mercedes executives say their plans have not been affected by
Chrysler's cash burn - estimated by analysts at more than $1 billion this
year. But privately, executives say Mercedes is slowing down technological
innovation, its hallmark for the past century. Furthermore, efforts to wring
out more savings through joint purchasing efforts with Chrysler and other
brands seem to be hurting Mercedes' quality.

That's Mercedes biggest problem now. In a recent survey of German car owners
conducted by Auto Motor und Sport motoring magazine, Lexus, Porsche, Honda
and BMW captured the four top slots, while Mercedes came in 17th. In J.D.
Power and Associates' 2003 U.S. vehicle dependability survey, Mercedes sank
to 26th place, from 16th a year ago.

"It's such a stark contrast to where they had been. In 1990, they were No.
1," said Brian Walters, J.D. Power's research director. "They just haven't
been able to keep up with the likes of Lexus and Toyota as a whole."

Posted by: kdfoust Oct 21 2003, 11:01 AM

I think Mercedes' slide started when they dropped the "Engineered Like No Other" from their advertising in the early '90s. They wanted to become a warm and fuzzy Mercedes...I don't think so. One of my old-school Mercedes collector buddies calls them "Uncle Merciless" and appropos nickname for Mercedes prior to the 90s.

Kevin

Posted by: Charles Deutsch Oct 21 2003, 11:03 AM

I blame Andy for Germany's decline.

Posted by: Mueller Oct 21 2003, 11:08 AM

if you did your research you'd find that the K car is what saved Chrysler from certain death, it also helped you and I and all consumers by offering at time unheard of car warrenties which started a trend

Posted by: Charles Deutsch Oct 21 2003, 11:14 AM

You're right - it was a marvelous piece of, um, engineering.

Posted by: jnp914 Oct 21 2003, 12:01 PM

One of the factors that made Chrysler attractive to Mercedes was the same thing that made AMC attractive to Chrysler: JEEP.

Jeep was a huge cash cow for Chrysler. One of the first things the Naz..... uhhhh Mercedes management accomplished was the looting of Chrysler's cash reserves. A huge chunk of which was from Jeep.

Now, Jeep is being cheapened by Chrysler. The hardcore capability is being slowly leached out, replaced by the likes of the Liberty. Yeesh. I am on my 9th Jeep product (YJs, TJs, XJs) and the Liberty reeks of RAV 4. But it is a money maker for Mercedes, and it costs less to make.

Expect to see whatever remains of Chrysler less Jeep spun off to someone like Hyundai.

Posted by: SirAndy Oct 21 2003, 12:06 PM

why do you think i had to leave?

Posted by: Charles Deutsch Oct 21 2003, 12:08 PM

So that's why California has such big problems now ...

Posted by: Mueller Oct 21 2003, 12:11 PM

call me strange, but I like my Hyundai !!!!

Posted by: Charles Deutsch Oct 21 2003, 12:12 PM

The Stellar, right?

Posted by: Pnambic Oct 21 2003, 12:25 PM

I thought I remembered that one of the big reasons that Daimler bought Chrysler was to obtain the manufacturing facilities already present here in the US thus getting around a lot of the taxes and tariffs and such incurred from shipping overseas.

Posted by: Hi_Fi_Guy Oct 21 2003, 12:26 PM

Chysler Jeep is the devil. I am in the middle of a huge nightmare with them. I used to be a Jeep enthusiats and have owned several Jeeps but if and when my ordeal with Chrysler Jeep is ever over I will never purchase another Chrysler product ever. Unfortunately I may have to extend that sentiment to Mercedes as well.

GM, Porsche, Land Rover, BMW, & Harley Davidson have always treated me with respect when dealing with any aspect of the ownership process... finance, sales, service, etc. Chrysler is simply trying to milk the Jeep enthusiats for all it can.

Jeep can burn.

Posted by: jnp914 Oct 21 2003, 12:32 PM

You can rip Jeep, but please keep in mind that every time Jeep scratches its ear it is Adolph, Jurgen and Manfred yanking the string.

Posted by: SirAndy Oct 21 2003, 01:21 PM

yepp, Arnold and me are taking over ... one state at the time ...
world-domination, finally it's within our grasp again.
conspiracy of the germs, ehr... Germans I mean.

Posted by: need4speed Oct 21 2003, 01:28 PM

Daimler bought them for the same reason any company buys another.

To eliminate competition.

The only question is - who's next? Ford? or GM?

Posted by: jnp914 Oct 21 2003, 01:53 PM

Competition? With what Benz products?

That would mean Mercedes would be moving down market. At the time Chrysler was sold, there wasn't one Chrysler branded car that any potential Mercedes buyer would buy. No overlap. None.

The most desirable products Chrysler had to offer in Europe were some minivans, the Viper, only Dodge did not exist in Europe so it was branded Chrysler, and Jeep.

If the only thing Mercedes wanted was to eliminate competition, it could have just sat back and watched Toyota devour Chrysler whole. Nothin' left but scraps. And it would have been a whole lot cheaper for Mercedes, when you consider what a millstone Chrysler turned out to be.

Posted by: J P Stein Oct 21 2003, 02:37 PM

Big companies do stupid things.....cause they're now run by bean counters.

Boeing bought MacDonald-Douglas....worse yet, they allowed the Mac people to infiltrate the Boeing management system.....these are the same folks that rand MickeyDoug down the tubes by not investing in new products. Figure that one out

Posted by: Charles Deutsch Oct 21 2003, 02:55 PM

Before their merger, Mercedes and Chrysler were probably the two auto companies that had the least product overlap. If I remember right, one of the stated reasons for the merger was that the combined company could save money sourcing and sharing parts, blah, blah, blah. At the time of the merger, Chrysler was actually the most profitable of the US car companies and I guess Daimler thought they would diversify, I dunno.

Posted by: redshift Oct 21 2003, 02:59 PM

Poopie pants? Knocked up a Hindenberg?


M

Posted by: redshift Oct 21 2003, 03:02 PM

MB has already lost their former fame, around here.

The fit and finish has fallen so far behind BMW, it's not even in the same class.

My folks both drive the big MBs, and my mother has (for the first time in 20 years) started talking about some BMW, and how great it drives.

It's not a real Chrysler.


M

Posted by: SirAndy Oct 21 2003, 03:05 PM

that too, but that's a completely different story

Posted by: Elliot Cannon Oct 21 2003, 03:53 PM

Hi,
My wife drives an E320 station wagon. It's the second Benz we have had and it will be the last. Too many little problems that you would not normally associate with the likes of MB including an exploding battery! I read an article that said their quality control went down hill since 1991 when they started making so many different models.
Cheers, Elliot

Posted by: Lawrence Oct 21 2003, 07:37 PM

My father retired, while working as a consultant to Chrysler. There is an inside joke about the merger:

"How do you say Damlier-Chrysler in German?"

"Damlier. The 'Chrysler' is silent."

Posted by: krk Oct 21 2003, 08:23 PM

Hm. Well, I actually find mergers/acquisitions interesting. I've been on both sides of this fence. As a buyer you have certain goals, and as as seller you have your own agenda. Both sides make internal predictions/projections and then bets are placed. Someone with "responsibility" is the "owner". It is very uncommon to see the whole story from either side -- NDA's usually keep the good bits quiet. The bigger the game, the larger the... well, you know.

Oh, did I mention that the oh-so-predictable market place does change under your feet? And it can toss a spanner into the works? Nah, that can't happen in the 914 world....

The second stage that is also interesting is the reality check. How do you deal with what you bought? How do you deal with being purchased? Did it really work out? Can you make it into something interesting? As the market changes/evolves, can you react appropriately? Etc.

These are difficult things to pull off. When they work, it's a wonderful thing, and when they don't (for whatever reason), they are what they are.

No, I can't fix a Jeep.

Sheesh, I'm troubled with my 914.

kim.