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Posted by: boxstr Feb 23 2007, 12:06 PM

The $50.00 paint job.
http://rickwrench.com:80/50dollarpaint.html

CCLIN914NATION

Posted by: tdgray Feb 23 2007, 12:13 PM

OK... somebody here has to try this. What a freakin hoot

Posted by: zymurgist Feb 23 2007, 12:24 PM

Heh. Babydoll's owner has been touching up the paint with Rustoleum white (my idea)... the shade is just about a perfect match.

Posted by: dkos Feb 23 2007, 12:31 PM

The original thread is here... http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=2331682&page=0&fpart=1&vc=1

If you have about 10 hours of free time it's an interesting read.

It's awesome...I'm going to try it when my rust repairs are done.

Posted by: dkos Feb 23 2007, 12:33 PM

69chargeryeehaa is the guy who invented this method. Just skip to his posts to get the gist of the technique.

Posted by: URY914 Feb 23 2007, 12:54 PM

I posted about this here about a year ago. I did a search but couldn't find it.

Posted by: Vacca Rabite Feb 23 2007, 01:00 PM

I read the entire thread on moparts last year. There was a point when the 69charger guy said "paint right over bare metal."

Then several pages later he said "okay, prime first if you are totally bare."

I seriously think about this as a paint option. But as my car is totally bare, I'll be needing a compresor and a gun anyhow for primer. I'm torn on it. I don't know how well it will work on some of the tight curves on a teener using a hard foam roller. I also don't want to have spent all winter prepping my tub to have to sand off a lot of rustoleum.

But the CSOB in me really wants to try it.

Maybe I should start testing on any of the chuncks of scrap metal that I have laying around.

Zach

Posted by: Brando Feb 23 2007, 01:05 PM

Instead of Rustoleum, try POR-15. I think that's the route I'll go. Thin it out, take down to bare metal. It's high-fill, right?

Posted by: Vacca Rabite Feb 23 2007, 01:08 PM

I know that you are joking.
But.
You are not supposed to thin Por-15 more then 10% The rustoleum mix is getting thinned to ~50% as I recall (the consistancy of water).

Zach

Posted by: URY914 Feb 23 2007, 01:10 PM

Rust-o-lum doesn't come in Signal Orange. So I'll be spraying mine.

Posted by: TROJANMAN Feb 23 2007, 01:18 PM

I think Trek should try it.
If you can buy it at home depot.............

can he reply to this thread, or is he still in time out

Posted by: dkos Feb 23 2007, 01:20 PM

Saftey Orange is pretty bitchin




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Posted by: SLITS Feb 23 2007, 01:27 PM

Kooooool .... new paint in time for the AR . The Brown Turd may just become Hunter Green .......

Posted by: 7T Porsha Feb 23 2007, 01:32 PM

I'm doing www.bluewatermarinepaint.com polyurethane.

Posted by: SLITS Feb 23 2007, 01:36 PM

He can post on the "Inalienable Free Rights Site" .... C______P

Posted by: kart54 Feb 23 2007, 01:53 PM

I beat trekkor to it. I did try this in part. I painted my bumpers and lower portion of the car this way. I needed to repair a front bumper that was damaged taking the car off the trailer at Buttonwillow and the lower valance and front of my rear flares had rock pits and a whole lot of rubber build up from rubber coming off the slicks in turn nine at Willow.

It's a lot of work.

What you don't spend in the cost of the paint you make up for in elbow grease. The job came out really nice. Once the rest of the car is done so I can roll it out into the sun I'll take some pictures and post them.

I used signal red. It is an exact match to the Honda S2000 red used by Honda in 2005. I also took this one step further. I sanded the final roll on coat with 1500 grit sandpaper and then sprayed with a HPLV gun the final coat which came out glassy and smooth. It looks as good or better than the $5,000 single stage honda 2000 red paint job on my Jensen Healey.
Given a choice, next time it will go to a paint shop. As good as it looks there was alot of trial and error and alot of elbow grease. I probably have close to what it would have cost in a shop just in my time. I did it at night over a couple of months but what a pain.
The one thing I can say is that this paint is definitely harder and more chip resistant than a shop paint job would have been. If you research rustoleum industrial paint, which is what this is, it's a farm tractor and implement paint used by several Manufacturers for factory paint on their tractors.
I figure the next time I go agricultural racing and I'm diggin up the desert, the car will feel right at home.
Randy
Car 54 G production Porsche SCCA

Posted by: fiid Feb 23 2007, 01:54 PM

ACE Hardware has a line of paint that is very similar to rust-o-leum with a nice orange shade called "Alice Chalmers Orange", which is probably what I will do my car with.

POR15 wouldn't work because it's sensitive to UV light - so it's supposed to be covered in exterior applications. You could use it as a base coat but I think it would be hard to get a good finish after brushing that on underneath.

Posted by: Series9 Feb 23 2007, 01:55 PM

That is awesome.

We should do one AT the AR. We could just hang out with beers and watch someone paint their car in front of the pub.

Posted by: TROJANMAN Feb 23 2007, 02:09 PM

I have just the car......

Posted by: Travis Neff Feb 23 2007, 02:18 PM

C'mon Joe, let's paint the cab of your truck..

Posted by: fiid Feb 23 2007, 02:24 PM

You guys are welcome to have a go at painting my car.

Seriously. Just don't crash it. It should be fine for a trip to AZ - and gets about 35 to the gallon.

Posted by: biosurfer1 Feb 23 2007, 02:30 PM

i have never heard of this technique but it looks interesting.

i'll get a hood during my extended vacation from work and give it a try!

Posted by: Eric_Shea Feb 23 2007, 02:54 PM

Yeah but does Rustoleum make that weird copper metallic color?

Posted by: marks914 Feb 23 2007, 02:55 PM

If you can polish stone, you can polish paint

mark

Posted by: MoveQik Feb 23 2007, 03:00 PM

....not that it needs it....I'll bring a roller!






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Posted by: type11969 Feb 23 2007, 03:20 PM

Rustoleum is the plan for my teener when the rust work is all done. It will be part of my progress thread (of which I have made very little in the past few weeks . . . ).

Posted by: Dr. Roger Feb 23 2007, 03:25 PM

Rustoleum Paint Code #7779. Glosss Black.


=-)

Still needs to be finished with the super fine paper but I'm happy so far.


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Posted by: dkos Feb 23 2007, 03:50 PM

Chris, I should have know this would appeal to you. Have you tried it yet? Are you rolling or spraying? Looks like a lot of work, but it sort of fits in with the rest of my restoration.

Posted by: type11969 Feb 23 2007, 04:02 PM

Rolling, I'd rather keep as much out of the air as possible. I figure it is worth a shot, I'd rather spend the time myself than pay to have it done professionally, we shall see how I feel afterwards.

Posted by: Bartlett 914 Feb 23 2007, 04:21 PM

I have heard that black is difficult. I was curious about how black would work. I am doing a rustoration on a black car. I am concerned about the mounting costs and this idea has some appeal. I hope you will keep us posted on your black car. If some issues come up, it will be very helpful to know before I jump into this. My cat wont be ready until late Spring or early summer.

The cost savings is very nice. The amount of work may be more. However if you are doing BC CC then maybe there is not more work. Both methods require a lot of wet sanding. What about doing a clear coat on top of this paint?

Posted by: Johny Blackstain Feb 23 2007, 04:33 PM

I own 3 black cars & all show every flaw w/ such precise detail it's a wonder why I put up w/ them. Black is by far the toughest paint to get to look good... sprayed. I immagine it's just as tough to get to look good rolled on as well.

Posted by: dakotaewing Feb 23 2007, 04:42 PM

If you are going to use a POR product, I would suggest you take a hard look at the "Hard Nose" product....

Thom

Posted by: Eric_Shea Feb 23 2007, 05:04 PM

I "never" would have imagined.

Posted by: biosurfer1 Feb 23 2007, 05:27 PM

just as an update, that webpage was made back in October, and he had a 4 month update on a different page...

http://rickwrench.com/50dollarpaint-4mos.html

Posted by: highways Feb 23 2007, 05:36 PM

Looks pretty interesting. Sounds like it's actually the same amount of work as spraying the paint (minus the gun cleaning and compressor tuning). Even spraying the paint you still have do all the same prep work and sanding/polishing between nearly every layer you put down. A few things make this look a little more tedious actually... A. this guy uses 6 coats to build up the color. A basecoat/clearcoat would only involve one coat of base and maybe two of clear (besides all the primer prep. B. the roller method looks like it takes longer then spraying- as spraying actually goes pretty fast- and flash times of modern stuff have you preping for the next coat inside of an hour.



Four months isn't much to base results on. The thing I would be concerned with his method is the quality of the pigment in the Rust-Oleum. Pigment is the key ingredient to nice color and longevity (aside from some sort of UV component)... and nice colors require alot of it and it's not cheap. I would be afraid of Rust-Oleum fading from the sun. This guy is in Canada where there's very little sun most of the year... and the month or two that does have sun... it's at a very low and diffused angle in the sky. California desert sun is a bit different.

I bought a small pint of generic medium priced red automotive paint one time to do a valence (which ofcourse didn't see much direct sunlight) and after only 9 months it turned pink. Currently I'm painting my car silver and going for with the high quality Dupont ChromaColor System because with the amount of labor you have to put into any painting job- you're just shooting yourself in the foot if you cut corners with cheap stuff. Although, I am impressed by his results. Maybe for a beater/daily driver in a light-low-fade color like white would be fine.

Edit: The thing that does look easy about his method is the learning curve. Seems pretty simple overall. For my project right now- I'm having to do alot of studying, reading professional car painter advice forums, learning the tech sheets for all the materials, learning about gun tuning and air supply, ect ect.. It's not really all that difficult in the end. A newbie can get good spray results with like one or two practice sessions on random panels. But there is alot of studying to do inorder to understand the behavior of the chemicals and how to diagnose and treat problems before they ruin the whole thing.

Posted by: kart54 Feb 23 2007, 08:41 PM

With regard to longevity I can say I don't think it's a concern. The wrought Iron in front of my house which is at the beach in Ventura was painted with rustoleum black gloss 8 years ago. It sees days of rain, sun, salt you name it. It doesn't get to hide in the garage and just see the sun every once in awhile but it's still in great shape with no fading. That was part of what made me think initially that this might work.
Wife is bored and wants a different color so it will probably get painted this summer but doesn't really need it.
Randy

Posted by: biosurfer1 Feb 23 2007, 08:53 PM

I figure if your car needs to get painted anyways, what the hell...give it a shot. its only going to cost you $50 and time.

Posted by: Pat Garvey Feb 23 2007, 09:14 PM

Back in the early 70's I worked with a guy at Kodak who had a '62 (I think) Rambler. He did a Rustoleum metal roof paint job (Seafoam) on it with a small roller. It looked as you would imagine - horrible orange peel. But, he didn't thin it because it was just a daily rustbelt driver & he wanted it done in an afternoon. Had to redo it every year for 4 years because it kept chalking & flaking.

Yeah, I know, he didn't prep correctly - but he didn't care. Roof paint?

I have used Rustoleum products with good success, in rattle cans. With proper prep & proper sanding & finishing it can work well - for parts.

Wouldn't dream of using it on bodywork.

Posted by: brer Feb 24 2007, 12:51 AM

you can roller real car paint too.

I know a group of mini cooper enthusiast in the UK that only paint their mini's with paint brushes because thats the way they have done it since the 60's.

bitchinist paint jobs you've ever seen.

paint
sand
paint
sand
paint
sand

repeat...

Posted by: Mike McGrath Feb 24 2007, 02:08 AM

My father was telling me about how, as a kid, he and his siblings tried to paint grandma's Ford wagon one time . . . using a paintbrush and a gallon of enamel housepaint. It obviously looked like garbage, but what do you expect for $2?

Posted by: marks914 Feb 24 2007, 04:54 AM

POR is not UV stable.

The hard nose stuff is VERY hard, I used some on my railing on my porch, I can't scratch it with a scrwedriver!

Mark

Posted by: pfierb Feb 24 2007, 05:01 AM

That's because the factory painted their cars with a brush.

Posted by: JPB Feb 24 2007, 07:38 AM

I've used Rustol... on trailers but always added some hardener so it can cure faster and get harder. Pot life is like one hour or so at 70F.

Posted by: Tobra Feb 24 2007, 01:46 PM

but do they have rustoleum in Phoenix Red?

Posted by: bmtrnavsky Oct 20 2010, 11:45 PM

Just curious for those of you who have done this how did it hold up?

Posted by: ws91420 Oct 21 2010, 11:13 AM

Go to the link and he has a three year update.

Posted by: SirAndy Oct 21 2010, 11:23 AM

I am tempted ...

Posted by: Vacca Rabite Oct 21 2010, 11:27 AM

You NEED hardener.
If you are doing a flat or semigloss, the hardner will add glass, so you need to add a flat agent as well.

Without the hardner, the paint will be very soft and easily scratched.

Zach

Posted by: SirAndy Oct 21 2010, 11:45 AM

What about a acrylic clear coat to cover it all?

Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 21 2010, 12:04 PM

I started a thread on 914world about painting my Monster SB and kinda got my ass kicked for my methodology. So I stopped posting here about it. You can read up if you like here:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=424156&start=0

I researched to the hills the rust-ol-eum painting methods. Bottom line is that it isn't true automotive paint and just won't turn out as nice or last as long.

Read what I'm still in the process of doing. It's real single stage paint, slow reducer and hardener. The only down side is it's basically a LPLV system.

But as long as you stick with the slow reducer and hardener, it flows and flattens out pretty nicely.

Posted by: bmtrnavsky Oct 21 2010, 01:36 PM

He actually has a 4 year update now and it looks really nice... I was just curious if anyone here had done it on a 914 and how it worked out.

Posted by: pete Oct 21 2010, 02:29 PM

A friend of my nephews painted his 80's Chevy short bed pick up with a couple cases of rattle can Rust o...in his back yard in NH under an ez-up tent. I have to say I was impressed with the finish. He said he really only wet sanded the last coat. This was a year later after enduring a nasty New England winter. Tons of salt used up there. Still looked pretty damn good. I also am a member of a home built airplane forum where a lot of the builders roll/brush on regular exterior latex home paint on their planes. Haven't tried it myself but lets face it, auto paint ain't cheap!

Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 21 2010, 03:55 PM

For good reason.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of rustoleum, but for things like engine parts, susp parts, under chassis stuff.

When it comes to putting paint on a car, there is rattle can (or roll on etc) and then there is real automotive paint like the factory uses. It's not a conspiricy or scam to make you pay more for paint and there isn't a need to justify using the rustoleum for painting a car. You wanna do it, then do it, have fun and be proud of your work.

Painting my whole squareback will cost about $150 for everything, bondo, paint, reducer, hardener, little mixing thingies, sand paper etc.

Well worth the extra $100 over having to tell people my car has rattle can paint on it.

That's just me, and I've been told I'm quite the dumbf*&% when it comes to cars, so maybe don't listen to me.

Posted by: okieflyr Oct 21 2010, 06:15 PM

I sprayed mine Sunburst Yellow 4 years ago. It was a stripped down auto-x car with fiberglass fenders and the first time I attempted this level of bodywork. The car didn't need a traditional paint job quality or expense. I was looking for a satin finish so it wouldn't highlight my mistakes. It cost less than $100 for all supplies and paint. The key for any paint job is prep. If your going to go balls out on your prep, then you may as well use an automotive paint since the labor is the biggest expense. I have never waxed the car, and the finish would be fine with a polish. I do consider the Rust-o paint to be slightly softer than traditional automotive paint.
I do believe that there are compatability issues in that you couldn't or would't want to shoot automotive paint over the oil base paint.

I am however going to reshoot it in the spring (with the same) when I take care of some bodywork rash and damage. I plan to wet sand the orange peel out of the current finish to help the new coats flow. If it is to be a real nice street car, I'd stay with auto paint. If it is a beater, have fun!

Posted by: r_towle Oct 22 2010, 08:08 AM

Just the fact that you can wipe off rustoleum with a lacquer thinner makes me wonder if it ever really cures.

Rich

Posted by: Gudhjem Oct 22 2010, 10:23 AM

I read a bunch of the $50 paint job threads and then tried it (using marine paint, which is supposed to be a step up from Rustoleum) on my trunk. In fact I tried it twice. I could never get the paint to harden enough so that it was sandable.

Posted by: Vacca Rabite Oct 22 2010, 06:18 PM

I can take over a month to fully cure. Sometimes like 60 days. Unless you use hardner.


See my comments about adding hardner.

The guy that did the bug and the Charger in orange Tremclad (Rustoleum) did not use hardner, but he was also thinning the paint so far that it was more thinner then paint, and would flash pretty quick. I think I remember that he was wet sanding to keep his paper from loading up too.

Zach

Zach

Posted by: okieflyr Oct 22 2010, 08:19 PM

All these years later mine is. I just went out and tried the laquer thinner on a rag, and the paint wouldn't budge. The finish didn't change and no paint came off. I used mineral spirits to thin the paint when it was sprayed for improved flow out.

Posted by: John Oct 24 2010, 12:57 PM

How much did you thin the paint to spray? I want to do a track only car with sprayed on rustoleum.

Posted by: MassTeener Jan 29 2011, 11:16 PM

Just curious if anyone has used TractorSupply's AC Orange with this application?

Would you use hardener and thin it with mineral to flatten it out?

Look's like a possible alternative for my AX'er

Posted by: okieflyr Jan 29 2011, 11:28 PM

You might be able to thin it, if it is oil base. Test Test Test before shooting,

Posted by: rohar Jan 30 2011, 10:00 AM

Kevin Black did his Scirocco dragster in Tractor Supply AC orange years ago. Didn't look too bad. Can't seem to find any pics this morning though.

I haven't seen the car since 2002 and it did 2 more years racing after that.

I HAVE used ACE house brand paint on a GOLF. Worked much like people are saying about RustO. Little cheaper and ACE seems to carry more colors than most shops cary RustO.

Posted by: underthetire Jan 30 2011, 11:30 AM

I work with the guys brother that painted that corvair. Lots of work, but has held up very well. That guy is super talented, did a ford wagon that came out really nice.

Posted by: MassTeener Jan 31 2011, 10:37 PM

So.......
Sounds like you pay Macco the $450 difference for the hours & hours of sanding & sanding & sanding

Posted by: Cevan Feb 1 2011, 09:38 AM

I would just get real automotive base and clearcoat. I'm restoring an old Honda and I bought a cheap gun from Harbor Freight. I spent about $60 on some inexpensive PPG Omni base and a PPG clearcoat. I used a two-part aerosol epoxy primer from SprayMax. This was with no sanding after the basecoat and I've done nothing to the clearcoat. And I've got enough materials left over to do about ten more tanks and side covers.

Posted by: underthetire Feb 1 2011, 09:49 AM

Except there is no cheap automotive paint in ca any longer. It's all water based, takes special guns etc..etc.., So to roll on the thinned solvent based derusto or whatever looks more cost effective for a cheap paint job.

Posted by: Root_Werks Feb 1 2011, 10:02 AM

I did my entire squareback with 2 quarts of Apline White (L80E or L90E?), a gallon of reducer and pint of hardener. All that cost about $125. Then I purchased about 8-9 of the Preval air cans for $2.86 each at a local hardware store, so another $26 or so.

$150, painted with real auto paint, hardener, reducer etc.

I guess we are lucky around here we can still buy the paint. Good option if you have it.


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Posted by: Root_Werks Feb 1 2011, 10:04 AM

The rear fenders:


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Posted by: r_towle Feb 1 2011, 10:06 AM

If this is like good old Laquer...I will try it.
I loved laquer when I shot a few other cars just cause its so forgiving.

http://www.duplicolor.com/products/psFinishSystem/

Rich

Posted by: underthetire Feb 1 2011, 10:19 AM

Says it needs clearcoat.

Posted by: Dr Evil Feb 1 2011, 10:21 AM

Scotty B refused to let me paint my bus with Rustoleum....what a perfectionist

I still think about doing it to a car some day.

Posted by: Randal Feb 1 2011, 10:31 AM

The gloss white is a dead match for Grand Prix White, i.e., a Porsche color, and I got the proof.




PS

When I was a kid, visiting my folks in Laguna in the summer, there were a couple of guys that lived up the street that restored Corvettes. For a paint job they just went down to Miracle and had them do a standard production job. When they got the car back they color sanded the entire car with 600 then 1000 then 1500 and the cars were beautiful.

I wonder if you couldn't save a lot of time by just putting on 3 or 4 coats and then sanding. I think I will try color sanding my spoiler on the trailer and figure it out.

Posted by: underthetire Feb 1 2011, 11:45 AM

So, for those of you who are laughing about this, the guy that did the corvair 3+ years ago is willing to come out to the transmission clinic in Discovery Bay so we can see it in person? Yes, No ??

Posted by: Dr Evil Feb 1 2011, 02:42 PM

Hell yes. All are welcome, and I love corvairs as well. Remember, I gutted one, supped up the guts, and shoved them into a bus

Posted by: realred914 Feb 1 2011, 04:28 PM

the smog wackos have just this year banned regular laquer thinner in california, we not get some toned down crappola, hell maybe have to use twice as much so screw them. the new stuff has less tolulene in it, and straight tolulene is no longer found at eh hardware store. the paint thinner is now a speacil california mix also, plus the price has skyrocketed.

the paints are manly waterborne now,a dn a pain to color match as they change color as they dry. forget about the good old PPG epoxy primers too (DP primer) they first took all the lead out and last year banned it completely it was great stuff.

remeber teh air resource board (CARB) is appoined by our elected numbskulls, so get on teh horn, or write to your state officals and let them know how mad you all are at these rules. Let tehm know you will vote them out if they keep supporting CARB.


guess it is time to go to Arizona to buy the good stuff.

CARB is doing everything to kill off the car hobby, their stated goal is to get you out of your car.

there are some industrial coatings and marine coatings that contain the good stuff that can be found still, they granted an exemption for marine and industrial for some chemicals cuase none of the pansy greenie stuff was suitable for these uses, so you may have some luck at a marine supply store for good (well at least decent) paint.

it is so bad i have to order a marine 3M product for vinyl protection from out of state it is basically a suoped up armor all (it works great) but is not sold in california.

beware of the new thinners, the bottles are not labled that they are different,
so run a test before commiting to diluting with the new stuff

besure to let your elected leaders know you do not approve of this.

Posted by: scotty b Feb 2 2011, 06:43 AM

First off it does not require a special gun,I have used it and it shot fine through my HVLP, second it's not ALL water born from what I am being told. Maybe in Cali it is now, but in Va the only thing that is water based is the base coat. Most of the primers and AFAIK all clears are all still solvent based. There are a lot of myths and rumors about water based materials that are scaring people off.

If someone in Cali that paints for a living can fill me in I'd like to know where you guys are with the water borne products. I know it is only a matter of time

Posted by: MassTeener Feb 2 2011, 09:45 PM

Yeah, what's with the clearcoat