 Bosch 009 Pertronix tuning, Looking for advice to get the car running again |
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| Chaznaster |
 May 17 2021, 05:33 PM
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#1
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Member  Group: Members Posts: 288 Joined: 22-November 15 From: Concord, MA Member No.: 19,389 Region Association: North East States 
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Hi All. I was working towards getting on the road formally this spring and seem to have caused a problem while digging around the engine bay.
It's a 74 1.8 with a single Weber progressive and an 009 distributor (I know nobody likes that setup ...) and Pertronix Ignitor. We have had it running (adjusted valves and timed it) and even put a few miles on it over the last few weeks. Today, out of interest and while trying to find out my Pertronix model number, I took the cap off the dizzy, pulled the rotor and magnetic sleeve and took out the Pertronix. There was no part number (ugh). I put it all back together (it has been running, albeit not well). When starting, I got a bright flash above the engine (!) and the car tried to run but it will not idle and backfires like crazy. So much so that I am not comfortable trying to start it again. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) I did check all the wires and plugs and all seems OK. I think the Pertronix is still working (it does fire). Could removing and replacing that part mess with timing or hurt the unit itself? I cannot see why but it is running like the timing is waaayyyy off. Does anyone here have any ideas on what I might have done to cause it to not run well. How about ideas of what I might do to get back on track? My only thought is to go back to points, static time it to start and go from there ... I really appreciate the help! |
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| bbrock |
May 17 2021, 05:42 PM
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#2
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,269 Joined: 17-February 17 From: Montana Member No.: 20,845 Region Association: Rocky Mountains
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Since it has a magnetic sleeve, that narrows it down to an Ignitor I or Ignitor II since the III doesn't have that sleeve. That also means the air gap needs to be set. Here is the installation instructions of an Ignitor II. Probably the same for a I but I'm not sure.
https://images.carid.com/pertronix/products...nstructions.pdf |
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| Shivers |
May 17 2021, 05:44 PM
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#3
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 2,323 Joined: 19-October 20 From: La Quinta, CA Member No.: 24,781 Region Association: Southern California |
Timing is out. If you did not loosen the dizzy clamp and rotate, then the pieces you pulled out did not go back in the same way. The flash was your engine trying to run backwards. Try rotating the distributor and see if you can get it to clear up. If so put the pieces back in the way they belong.
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| nditiz1 |
May 17 2021, 06:03 PM
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#4
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,177 Joined: 26-May 15 From: Mount Airy, Maryland Member No.: 18,763 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
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I just had my first run in with faulty pertronix svda. I had been neglecting my silver 60 beetle. I decided to put fresh rubber and get it back to decent driving condition. Cleaned out the 34 pict 3. Couldn't get it running right. Swapped out the carb, still not right. Finally started messing with pulling the plugs and one was not firing. I even swapped wires l, nope. Swapped it out for my old known working 009 and she was running on all 4. This one is only 6 Mo old and has never really been run. I was pretty amazed. Sending it out to pertronix to be fixed.
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| IronHillRestorations |
May 17 2021, 07:43 PM
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#5
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I. I. R. C. Group: Members Posts: 6,712 Joined: 18-March 03 From: West TN Member No.: 439 Region Association: None
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Is it possible you connected the coil wrong? You can bench test it.
The flash means you fried something. |
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| brant |
May 18 2021, 09:58 AM
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#6
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914 Wizard Group: Members Posts: 11,603 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Colorado Member No.: 47 Region Association: Rocky Mountains 
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reset the gap inside the distributor with the pertronix
similar to resetting the points if you had pulled a set out and reinstalled.... |
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| Chaznaster |
May 18 2021, 10:00 AM
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 288 Joined: 22-November 15 From: Concord, MA Member No.: 19,389 Region Association: North East States
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Thanks All ...
This is turning out to be a big egg-on-the face moment. I went back in to look around and it looks like I did not tighten down the dizzy after timing it on Sunday. The engine most definitely turned it clockwise (right?). So when I replied the dizzy parts and restarted, the timing was waaaaay off. So I have a few thoughts: 1) definitely static time to get close before starting again. 2) I get that the flash was something frying (electrical flash - bright white) but without FI, there is not much there to fry. The board in the engine compartment looks OK and I cannot see damage around the coil or ignitor. There are no melted wires I can see. Fuses are OK.And it does try to start. 3) is there any chance I damaged anything internal to the engine? Fortunately, I have a new coil and plug wires coming as the old ones were due for replacement. I appreciate any additional help on this! |
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| Chaznaster |
May 18 2021, 10:38 AM
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 288 Joined: 22-November 15 From: Concord, MA Member No.: 19,389 Region Association: North East States
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QUOTE(brant @ May 18 2021, 11:58 AM)  reset the gap inside the distributor with the pertronix similar to resetting the points if you had pulled a set out and reinstalled.... I looked into that. The igniter I have does not have an adjustable gap. It locks down with a screw and pin that fits in the base. And the igniter base plate goes completely around the shaft. |
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| Chaznaster |
May 18 2021, 01:48 PM
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#9
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Member Group: Members Posts: 288 Joined: 22-November 15 From: Concord, MA Member No.: 19,389 Region Association: North East States
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QUOTE(IronHillRestorations @ May 17 2021, 09:43 PM) Is it possible you connected the coil wrong? You can bench test it. The flash means you fried something. Thank you. I'll bench test tonight. Fried sounds bad. And thoughts on what it could have been? |
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| porschetub |
May 18 2021, 01:55 PM
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#10
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,696 Joined: 25-July 15 From: New Zealand Member No.: 18,995 Region Association: None |
QUOTE(Chaznaster @ May 19 2021, 04:38 AM) QUOTE(brant @ May 18 2021, 11:58 AM) reset the gap inside the distributor with the pertronix similar to resetting the points if you had pulled a set out and reinstalled.... I looked into that. The igniter I have does not have an adjustable gap. It locks down with a screw and pin that fits in the base. And the igniter base plate goes completely around the shaft. Ignitor II comes with a gap setting tool from memory,been a while since I fitted one. |
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| Chaznaster |
Jun 13 2021, 04:52 PM
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 288 Joined: 22-November 15 From: Concord, MA Member No.: 19,389 Region Association: North East States
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So it took a while but I finally figured out that two things had happed to cause the non-starting.
1) did not tighten the distributor after timing so it turned itself out 2) when fiddling with the Pertronix, one of the magnets from the "doughnut" on the dizzy shaft popped out (the piece separated). So found the missing magnet and got that squared away and re-timed and things sound pretty good. FYI the Pertonix is a Ignitor I (1?). The config for the 009 distributor has a fixed sensor so no adjustments possible or necessary. Thanks for the help on this. |
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