914-6/904 project begins Options

[gereed75]

Or substantially shorten the strut and use shorter inserts. Then you could lower the shock tower. Could be done, though not for the faint of heart ...

Why go through all of that when this is available http://www.coolrydescustoms.com/store/c2/M...SUSPENSION.html And it is not real pricey

[naro914]

I've just spent (wasted??) that last hour+ reading through all 15 pages of this thread...

The biggest thing that upsets me is: how did I miss that car when it was on eBay for $15000??? I have always wanted a historically significant 914 race car, but they have always been way out of my league price wise....If I would have known about this car, I would have bought it instantly and restored it to its racing glory for vintage racing.

Adam, what you see as 'old and tired', vintage racers see as 'history and exciting'. What you say was 'obsolete in racing' is certainly not in the vintage world...

You keep saying you're making it a Porsche, but are you? To me, and to many, it's a kit car just like all the VW based kit cars - a fiberglass body on a VW chassis. The body is NOT made by Porsche, you're going to have to hack the chassis smaller (good luck with that btw). So no, it's not a Porsche any more than Beck's cars are Porsche's. I had a Beck 550 Spyder with a Porsche engine, Porsche transmission and Porsche suspension components in it...and guess what? It was still a kit car...

Some very smart people here have posted some of the engineering hurdles you are going to face - most of which are going to be VERY expensive and VERY tricky to overcome. It is really worth it just to say you were able to make a 904 out of a 914?

You bought the car, you obviously have every right to do what you want. It just saddens me to see a true piece of Porsche racing history - and something I always wanted to own - cut up to build a kit car.

Good luck with your build.

[wndsnd]

Took this shot of the dash, some more recent history.

Posting these pictures doesnt actually help you win over the dissenters either.

[Unobtanium-inc]

I've just spent (wasted??) that last hour+ reading through all 15 pages of this thread...

The biggest thing that upsets me is: how did I miss that car when it was on eBay for $15000??? I have always wanted a historically significant 914 race car, but they have always been way out of my league price wise....If I would have known about this car, I would have bought it instantly and restored it to its racing glory for vintage racing.

Adam, what you see as 'old and tired', vintage racers see as 'history and exciting'. What you say was 'obsolete in racing' is certainly not in the vintage world...

You keep saying you're making it a Porsche, but are you? To me, and to many, it's a kit car just like all the VW based kit cars - a fiberglass body on a VW chassis. The body is NOT made by Porsche, you're going to have to hack the chassis smaller (good luck with that btw). So no, it's not a Porsche any more than Beck's cars are Porsche's. I had a Beck 550 Spyder with a Porsche engine, Porsche transmission and Porsche suspension components in it...and guess what? It was still a kit car...

Some very smart people here have posted some of the engineering hurdles you are going to face - most of which are going to be VERY expensive and VERY tricky to overcome. It is really worth it just to say you were able to make a 904 out of a 914?

You bought the car, you obviously have every right to do what you want. It just saddens me to see a true piece of Porsche racing history - and something I always wanted to own - cut up to build a kit car.

Good luck with your build.

I don't know how you missed it, the car has been for sale off and on since 2007, on Pelican, ebay, everywhere. It sold in 2011, and that guy never drove it, not once. He then tried to sell it on ebay forever, there were no takers except me.
As far as something being a kit car or not, if a car is on a Porsche chassis, and retains a Porsche VIN, it's a Porsche. Everytime something like this comes up I bring up 550-0001, when it was found in Guadalahara, a friend of mine was sent down to appraise it before it was auctioned off on the floor of the Shoe Factory where it was found. His client bought the car for about $400,000, bailed halfway through the restoration, and the Collier people took the baton and spend who knows how much restoring the car, but if you look at the restoration photos on my blog, very little of that car was ever touched by Porsche. In fact, my friend that went down there confided to me that there was enough original pieces on that car that he could have fit them all into his suitcase to fly home. Yet, 550-0001 is shown all around the world and I doubt anyone is walking up to it at the Collier Collection and saying it is anything other than the 1st Spyder, though my guess would be 15% of it is original.
So me re-bodying a 914 into a dream car it is still a Porsche. In fact I skinned the fiberglass body off the car when I got it, so putting a new skin on really doesn't change much. Not everyone will agree with me, but then I had plenty of nay-sayers when I first starting cutting on Da Spoodster, plenty of people said I should have welded a roof back on and made it back into a 58 A Coupe, except it was my car, my dream, and I had buyers begging me for the car before it was even finished.

Here are pics of 550-0001 on my blog:
<https://unobtaniuminc.wordpress.com/2011/09/30/porsche-550-01-spyder-the-prototype-giant-killer/>
https://unobtaniuminc.wordpress.com/2011/09...e-giant-killer/

[ThePaintedMan]

Just get on with it already. You ain't selling, so might as well start (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sawzall-smiley.gif)

[Unobtanium-inc]

Just get on with it already. You ain't selling, so might as well start (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sawzall-smiley.gif)

I'm months away from cutting on anything but the center seat wonder.

[mgp4591]

That 550-0001 is SO damn hot looking with that custom roof! Any other pictures of it with the roof on after completion- you never know where you might get your next idea to make a car unique! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_pokal.gif)

[gereed75]

That 550-0001 is SO damn hot looking with that custom roof! Any other pictures of it with the roof on after completion- you never know where you might get your next idea to make a car unique! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_pokal.gif)

0001 was a painstaking reproduction of a Porsche probably using original factory drawings to get every detail exactly as the factory made it, using period correct replacement parts where available. There is no correlation to that effort and hacking a 914 to fit under a 904 body. You are not starting with even 15% of an original 904

I am not suggesting that you ever said that you are trying to create a 904 reproduction. I am only suggesting that using 0001 as an analogy to your situation is a very big stretch.

Besides the fact that you are destroying a historic race car (and any upside value that it might have to you or anyone else) I think it is your logic that using this old race car as a base will somehow give your car more pedigree is very vexing to some people.

Had you just said "I am hacking up an old 914 to try to fit under a 904' you would have heard nothing but encouragements

How about this idea.... Print up some for sale flyers emphasing the car's history and give them to someone going to Rennsport reunion who is willing to hawk it for you. I bet you sell the car for enough to buy a conversion if your single seat cut trials prove that this is a doable project. You have time to do that, it might save the historic car and if the project turns out to be not feasible, you are bucks ahead.

Peace,out.

PS. I recently saw the old #40 look alike car at an historic race. It was sold by Aircooled Racing. You saw it at Hersey. It had no where near the provenance of your car and was in very sorry shape. I believe the guy paid $40,000.00

[wingnut86]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer3.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sheeplove.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/sawzall-smiley.gif)

Cut-Her-Up...

Bring out the Torch!

...in other words - It's His Money, and his time.

Get over it... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/slap.gif)

[gereed75]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer3.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sheeplove.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/sawzall-smiley.gif)

Cut-Her-Up...

Bring out the Torch!

...in other words - It's His Money, and his time.

Get over it... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/slap.gif)

We are all over it. Just trying to save a valuable historic car from an undeserved fate.

[rhodyguy]

good luck with that.

[JmuRiz]

Thank goodness they didn't make 550-001 into a 356/1 replica....hey it's a cooler looking Porsche and has a mid-engine right (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Who cares if 550-001 has race history, I like the look of 356/1 better.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/hide.gif)
just messing with you

On a more important note, has unobtanium gotten any sort-of-round 356 speaker grills, or 6v external driving lights? I need some for my car, talked over the idea of the lights with Scotty and I want to see how they'll look.

[wingnut86]

Noted:

OomPah Loompah knee-breakers dispatched to your location

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif)

Thank goodness they didn't make 550-001 into a 356/1 replica....hey it's a cooler looking Porsche and has a mid-engine right (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Who cares if 550-001 has race history, I like the look of 356/1 better.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/hide.gif)

[914Timo]

If I understood correctly, your idea was to use ready 914 conversion to save time and work in this project. Now you are talking about chancing the whole front suspension and shortening the wheelbase many inches. To me it sounds welding the front engine mount to any 914 is just piece of cake compared what you are doing. I have done only one 914-6 conversion, and welding that mount was one of the easiest part in the whole process. Finding all the parts and enough information how to do it were my problems. I did my conversion 14 years ago and didn´t have any helping 914 friends here in north Europe. If you have done all the cars I have understood and own that much engines, transmissions and other parts you mentioned before, making a conversion shouldn´t be any problem for you. Actually, my opinion is, it would be a lot easier to start from all original non-modified 914 tub. I suppose you will have to cut and modify that rollcage. A lot. So, at the end it will look like that too. Old modified rollcage. A compromise. But, if you are after some rat-904-look, maybe thats what you are looking for. I hate rats and all rat-lookers.

I am not going to hide I like old restored racing cars. I think Mr Stazak and others here are doing wonderful job restoring those old racers. But, as much as I like them, I would also like to see one well done and hi-quality 904/914 conversion kit-car. You have very nice idea, but I think you should re-consider you starting point. I am sure it will pay back later (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

[Unobtanium-inc]

If I understood correctly, your idea was to use ready 914 conversion to save time and work in this project. Now you are talking about chancing the whole front suspension and shortening the wheelbase many inches. To me it sounds welding the front engine mount to any 914 is just piece of cake compared what you are doing. I have done only one 914-6 conversion, and welding that mount was one of the easiest part in the whole process. Finding all the parts and enough information how to do it were my problems. I did my conversion 14 years ago and didn´t have any helping 914 friends here in north Europe. If you have done all the cars I have understood and own that much engines, transmissions and other parts you mentioned before, making a conversion shouldn´t be any problem for you. Actually, my opinion is, it would be a lot easier to start from all original non-modified 914 tub. I suppose you will have to cut and modify that rollcage. A lot. So, at the end it will look like that too. Old modified rollcage. A compromise. But, if you are after some rat-904-look, maybe thats what you are looking for. I hate rats and all rat-lookers.

I am not going to hide I like old restored racing cars. I think Mr Stazak and others here are doing wonderful job restoring those old racers. But, as much as I like them, I would also like to see one well done and hi-quality 904/914 conversion kit-car. You have very nice idea, but I think you should re-consider you starting point. I am sure it will pay back later (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

Doing a conversion isn't that tough, I agree, but finding a known 6 motor, gearbox, and brakes, and getting them all working is the problem. That's while all the shops were quoting me $20000-30000 to do it. Priced a 911 engine rebuild lately?

All I wanted with this project was a running and driving six cylinder car, and the only one under $30,000 I could find was this one. I've now dropped more money into it and it is fully sorted, right where I need it. To date no one has wanted it bad enough to make me an acceptable offer. And yes, I have set the conditions of deal high, because I worked hard to find a car, had to ship it here, get it sorted, and now and only now can I really start on the rest of the project so I'm not going to be quick to start over with a bunch of unknowns. I doubt any one of you guys would feel any different in my place, in fact I know you wouldn't because when I put the word out to buy a 914/6 conversion everyone on this board who wanted to sell me one gave me a long list of hills they had to climb to do their car, so that's why they wanted high money for their car. That was their right, just as it is mine.

[MMW]

I plan to head up to Adam's on Saturday for the open house. Can't wait to check this out in person & hear it run.

[GaroldShaffer]

If I understood correctly, your idea was to use ready 914 conversion to save time and work in this project. Now you are talking about chancing the whole front suspension and shortening the wheelbase many inches. To me it sounds welding the front engine mount to any 914 is just piece of cake compared what you are doing. I have done only one 914-6 conversion, and welding that mount was one of the easiest part in the whole process. Finding all the parts and enough information how to do it were my problems. I did my conversion 14 years ago and didn´t have any helping 914 friends here in north Europe. If you have done all the cars I have understood and own that much engines, transmissions and other parts you mentioned before, making a conversion shouldn´t be any problem for you. Actually, my opinion is, it would be a lot easier to start from all original non-modified 914 tub. I suppose you will have to cut and modify that rollcage. A lot. So, at the end it will look like that too. Old modified rollcage. A compromise. But, if you are after some rat-904-look, maybe thats what you are looking for. I hate rats and all rat-lookers.

I am not going to hide I like old restored racing cars. I think Mr Stazak and others here are doing wonderful job restoring those old racers. But, as much as I like them, I would also like to see one well done and hi-quality 904/914 conversion kit-car. You have very nice idea, but I think you should re-consider you starting point. I am sure it will pay back later (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

Doing a conversion isn't that tough, I agree, but finding a known 6 motor, gearbox, and brakes, and getting them all working is the problem. That's while all the shops were quoting me $20000-30000 to do it. Priced a 911 engine rebuild lately?

All I wanted with this project was a running and driving six cylinder car, and the only one under $30,000 I could find was this one. I've now dropped more money into it and it is fully sorted, right where I need it. To date no one has wanted it bad enough to make me an acceptable offer. And yes, I have set the conditions of deal high, because I worked hard to find a car, had to ship it here, get it sorted, and now and only now can I really start on the rest of the project so I'm not going to be quick to start over with a bunch of unknowns. I doubt any one of you guys would feel any different in my place, in fact I know you wouldn't because when I put the word out to buy a 914/6 conversion everyone on this board who wanted to sell me one gave me a long list of hills they had to climb to do their car, so that's why they wanted high money for their car. That was their right, just as it is mine.

Waa Waa Waa so what is YOUR price for this car, I guess I missed it? All I see is you want a VIN that is from a Porsche and nothing else because if you have to hack the 914 chassis as much as it is looking you need to do for this, then that is all you have left. All the conversion parts can be bought anywhere.

Yes I seen the racecar for sale also, but I couldn't justify spending the money as I am not a roadracer.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) with gereed75 when he said

"How about this idea.... Print up some for sale flyers emphasing the car's history and give them to someone going to Rennsport reunion who is willing to hawk it for you. I bet you sell the car for enough to buy a conversion if your single seat cut trials prove that this is a doable project. You have time to do that, it might save the historic car and if the project turns out to be not feasible, you are bucks ahead."

What do you have to loose? A chance to make some money above what you have spent so far. In the end you are going to find that making a tube frame chassis for your 904 project will save you tons of time & $$ in the long run.

[Unobtanium-inc]

I'm not sure why I keep having to say the same things trying to justify my project on a car no one wanted. And still no one really wants it or they would have made a real offer for it.

So let's do this, let's focus on the ideas for the project, those were coming in nice. If you don't agree with the build, we have heard everyone's opinion on that.

[GaroldShaffer]

I'm not sure why I keep having to say the same things trying to justify my project on a car no one wanted. And still no one really wants it or they would have made a real offer for it.

So let's do this, let's focus on the ideas for the project, those were coming in nice. If you don't agree with the build, we have heard everyone's opinion on that.

Yes REALLY you keep saying no one has made you a real offer so........ how much will it take??? $30k, $40K, $50k.......$1 dollar (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

[Unobtanium-inc]

I'm not sure why I keep having to say the same things trying to justify my project on a car no one wanted. And still no one really wants it or they would have made a real offer for it.

So let's do this, let's focus on the ideas for the project, those were coming in nice. If you don't agree with the build, we have heard everyone's opinion on that.

Yes REALLY you keep saying no one has made you a real offer so........ how much will it take??? $30k, $40K, $50k.......$1 dollar (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

I don't want to sell it, I've said that from the beginning. I found the car, bought it, shipped it, paid $$$ to sort it, and now it's ready. When I first started the project I had several months to play with before the body was done so when there was an uproar on the forum about the car and the project I extended the offer if anyone wanted to trade their running driving six conversion for it, even with horrible cosmetics, I would entertain the offer. I got nothing, crickets, silence. Now months later I have received a couple of offers that have not come close to what I said I would trade for. So no I don't have a price to sell the car, I don't want to sell it. I am also out of time because the body is here and I want to start on the project, not have to go back to square one on the project. So once again, the car was offered to the 914 community months ago and no one wanted it, or didn't want it bad enough to give up their car. It's too bad that for the people who profess they would and should do everything to save this car, either don't have the money for it, or don't really care enough. I came out of the pocket to buy the car when no one else would, I came out of the pocket to get the car up to snuff, and now I'm the bad guy because I want to use the car for my project. This is America, if you want something, you buy it, I did, when no one else would. This car had been for sale off and on for 8 years, yes 8 years. So everyone had a shot to buy it, no one cared. But now that I have thousands invested everyone wants to crucify me. It's getting real tiresome. I put the thread on here because I thought I was doing something pretty cool, taking a car that had been put out to pasture and breathing new life into it, jumping through a lot of hurdles on the way, to build one of my dream cars, and all I've gotten out of a bunch of you is grief, so please, go talk trash somewhere else, or come by on Saturday and say it to my face. But there are no new arguements here, or offers, or anything, just pissed off guys who don't even put there names to their words, taking jabs at a guy sharing his passion for Porsches and his latest project. Move on, grow up, get a massage, something, but please stop saying the same things, again and again and again.

Adam Wright
Unobtanium-Inc