Update Buick V6 in 914, It's In! Options

[dbledsoe]

QUOTE (914GT @ Oct 4 2005, 11:07 AM)

Thanks for the air cleaner info. Here's how I modified the stock 76 bumper. From usual standing height the opening is hardly noticeable so retains nearly original look. So far seems to be enough airflow (it can pull from the bottom front of the trunk too). Look forward to seeing your new bumper mounted in place.

Guy,

That is difficult to see from just about any position except the one the photo was taken from, or from underneath. Very slick! How many square inches would you estimate your opening is? Mine can pull from the bottom of the front trunk too as I have a smaller opening cut in there. I would prefer to keep the bumper opening as small as possible but am not sure just how many square inches I should start with.

[dbledsoe]

QUOTE (pjhaun @ Oct 4 2005, 12:43 PM)

QUOTE (dbledsoe @ Oct 4 2005, 07:58 AM) Expansion/fill tank Where does the bottom of the expension tank go to? Also can you provide a picture of how you connected the engine mount to the frame of the 914. Thank You!!!! Phillip J. Haun Oak Harbor, Wa.

Hello Phillip,

The expansion tank has three lines to/from it. The upper line from the tank body goes to the intake manifold water passage near the thremostat housing. The lower line from the tank body runs to the inlet side of the water pump. The highest line (clear plastic) is the overflow line and it runs to the plastic overflow tank you see in the photos.

The engine mount crossmember bolts to the same place as the original Porsche engine mount crossmember except that it bolts to the frame from the top side rather than the bottom side. The phot below shows what it looks like out of the car but that is the exact smae position it will have installed. The welded feet you see in the photo replace the original plate that the original engine mount crossmember bolted to. The two ends of the crossmember telescope to facilitate installation into the chassis and are then pulled out to mate to the engine mounting points on the chassis. The feet of my crossmemebr are drilled and threaded to accept two 3/8" bolts on each side. Once the crossmemeber is in place the bolts are run up from beneath the care and tightened down. Once that is complete I then drilled a pair of 1/4" holes through each end of the crossmemeber and into and through the 1 1/2" bars on the ends. I put a pair of quick 1/4" release pins in each of those holes to keep the crossmember from sliding side to side or rotating on axis.

I hope that makes sense.

I'll try to get a better picture of how the mount bolts to the chassis tonight and post it tomorrow.

Don

[dbledsoe]

QUOTE (Brian Mifsud @ Oct 4 2005, 11:06 AM)

Hi, Sure is nice work. How does the engine's torque curve match up with the transmission? Do you feel it is overrevving on the freeway? I'm guessing you have stock final drive ratio? V-6 certainly seems to have the right "sound" for a 914. I had that V-6 in my '78 El Camino.. engine was great, but the emissions system and "intelligent" carb where a constant nightmare.

I think the trans final ratio (fifth gear) is going to be a bit low for continued freeway speed type driving with the V6. But I don't do much freeway driving so am not too concerend with it. The bulk of my driving is on rural two lane roads or around town. But I haven't actually had it out on the freeway yet to confirm that.

[914GT]

For sure it would be nice to have a higher gear for fuel economy reasons. Lower rpms would help bring the noise level down a bit too, depending on the engine, exhaust, and sound dampening inside the car. But if your V6 is well balanced it should be fine on the highway and have way more power and throttle response above 3000 rpm than the original 4. My V8 cruises all day at 3200 rpm and is quiet. These engines spin just fine at high rpms.

[dbledsoe]

QUOTE (914GT @ Oct 4 2005, 03:33 PM)

For sure it would be nice to have a higher gear for fuel economy reasons. Lower rpms would help bring the noise level down a bit too, depending on the engine, exhaust, and sound dampening inside the car. But if your V6 is well balanced it should be fine on the highway and have way more power and throttle response above 3000 rpm than the original 4. My V8 cruises all day at 3200 rpm and is quiet. These engines spin just fine at high rpms.

Guy,

Not sure if you read my earlier message but I am curious as to what the approximate square inches of your inlet to the radiator might be?

After doing the Buick V6 conversion I am now seriously reconsidering the conversion I plan to do in my white 76 914. I think I just may go with Chevy SMB engine rather than doing Buick 4.1L V6 conversion. I'll build the 4.1L Buick engine (and hot rod it a good deal more than the current 3.8 V6) but just may drop it into the red 75 914 instead.

You're a fantastic inspiration in that respect, in all respects!

Thank you for all you words of encouragement and for your excellent threads on your conversions!

Don

[914GT]

Don,

I made the intake opening on the red 76 the same as my yellow 74. The opening is divided into two sections by a piece of 1" square tubing rolled to match the original curvature of the front end. This tubing adds reinforcement where the original front panel and bottom trunk were spot welded together. The bottom trunk floor opening is approx. 22" x 7". The top opening behind the bumper is approx. 22" x 4.5". Therefore the total intake area is 253 sq. in.

The bumper cutout on my 74 allows for more direct airflow into the front of the car, where the big bumper and valence on the 76 tend to 'shadow' part of the opening. Air can still get around them but I'm sure there's more turbulance at highway speeds. However when stopped and using only the fans, I'm sure the air flow is the same for both cars. I thought of making a small air dam at the rear of the trunk opening on my 74 to try to create a high-pressure area in front of the trunk cutout. I never did and since my car always runs cool I have never been motivated to try it.

Appreciate your kind words. I learned much from other folks that have been doing this for a lot longer than me. I like experimenting and trying new things, and it's great seeing others like you doing the same thing and seeing what ideas you come up with.

[pjhaun]

Don:

I forgot to ask you, What kind/type alternator bracket did you use? Do you happen to have pictures of the front of the engine with the belts and brackets in place?

Thank You!!!!!
Phillip J. Haun
Oak Harbor, WA.

[dbledsoe]

QUOTE (pjhaun @ Oct 5 2005, 12:09 AM)

Don: I forgot to ask you, What kind/type alternator bracket did you use? Do you happen to have pictures of the front of the engine with the belts and brackets in place? Thank You!!!!! Phillip J. Haun Oak Harbor, WA.

Phillip,

below is a close up of one end of the mount I made and the photo below that is the same end of the mount as installed in the 914. I hope they give you a better idea of how I mounted my engine. The circled item in the upper left corner of the second photo below is the 1/4" quick release pin that keeps the mount from moving side to side when bolted in place in the car.

[dbledsoe]

Installed

[914GT]

It would be interesting to apply this motor mount bar concept to a V8 - to improve the ground clearance and eliminate the need to notch the shift rod. Maybe the next conversion project....

[dbledsoe]

I used the original 914 alternator minus the back plate. I have no idea how long it will last because it has no fan on it and doesn't get air forced through it as it would if in use on the type IV engine. But since it was a new rebuilt alternator only a year old and saw very little use before my type IV engine died I decide to go with it and see how long it lasts.

I didn't actually make or use a mounting bracket. I made up a pair of spacers that I could slip a long (6") 3/8" bolt through. The spacer goes between the alternator and cylinder head bolt hole circled in the photo below (the lower of the two circled in the photo) and bolted the alternator directly to the cylinder head. Then I used a slightly modified small block Chevy alternator adjustment bracket with another 3/8" bolt and long spacer bolted to the upper of the two bolt holes circled in the photo below. The bracket is available at most FLAPS that carry chrome goodies. I had to shorten it a little and redrill a 3/8" hole.

It's difficult to explain so I'll try to get a photo of it tonight that shows what I'm talking about. I don’t know how good the photo will show what I’m talking about because it may be difficult to get the camera down there as its pretty tight quarters.

If you find a source for an alternator bracket that will mount a standard GM alternator low on the driver’s side of the engine let me know as I imagine I'll need one sooner or later. I don't expect the original Bosch alternator I'm using to last too long when it gets hot again next summer.

[dbledsoe]

QUOTE (914GT @ Oct 5 2005, 09:52 AM)

It would be interesting to apply this motor mount bar concept to a V8 - to improve the ground clearance and eliminate the need to notch the shift rod. Maybe the next conversion project....

Guy,

It's a pretty simple design but appears that it will work just fine. It defintely gives a lot more ground clearance and leaves plenty of room for shift rod clearance.

Don

[dbledsoe]

OK, it's getting there. Got the new GT Racing fiberglass front bumper installed. I won't be cutting (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/sawzall-smiley.gif) an opening in it just yet. I'm going to build some ducting from the fog lamp grill openings to the radiator to see how that works. I'm sure it will get me through the winter/spring months up here and will take a wait and see on how it does during the summer months before cutting anything. I've still got two more hood pins to install yet, which is why the hood looks like it doesn't come down all the way in the photo below. It won't without the hood pins and clips.

Next Tuesday morning (October 18th) I have an appointment with the muffler shop that does all the local hot rods to get an exhaust system installed. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/welder.gif) and then it will be legal to drive (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/driving.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rocking nana.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/monkeydance.gif) and then it will be time to celebrate. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/drunk.gif)

[dbledsoe]

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smash.gif)

[dbledsoe]

Another update on my Buick V6/914 conversion.

I did my conversion last spring and summer and got the 914 up and running but ran into a little problem with vibration at 2000 RPM. The flywheel wasn’t balanced correctly to the internals of the engine. When I built/rebuilt the engine it was as stock with the exception of a mild cam, Edelbrock intake manifold, 390 cfm Holley four barrel carb, Sanderson headers, and MSD billet distributor and ignition box. The conversion was pretty straight forward once all the parts and pieces got into place. But because of the vibration I decided to go ahead and drive it as is while I build another engine, then I'll do a weekend swap of the new engine for the current engine. The engine that’s currently in my 914 is a 3.8 liter Buick V6 and the new engine I’m building is a 4.1 liter Buick V6, which was in production for only for 4 years and I was lucky enough to find a good motor with no block or head cracks.

This time around I found a machinist who is very familiar with the Buick V6 and together we’re doing it right. By right I mean align hone the mains, deck the block to match the deck height of the new piston/rod configuration, and bore the block (with torque plates in place), Manley stainless valves, JE forged 9 ½ : 1 pistons, completely rebuilt connecting rods bushed for free floated pins, and the addition of ARP rod bolts. I also added an Isky cam of .470” lift/270 duration, Isky lifters, valve springs and retainers, combustion chambers CC’d to equal volume (45cc, talk about tiny combustion chambers volumes for a 4" bore!), and a bunch of other stuff. All the machine work on the engine is complete and I’m now waiting on a new flywheel from Kennedy Engineering so the whole assembly can be balanced correctly.

I find the 3.8 liter V6 in the 914 to be impressive in its current configuration in terms of power, so this new 4.1 liter should be REALLY impressive. It’ll be a couple of months yet before I do the engine swap out due to cold ass weather here in the northwest and still waiting on a few parts to come in. I’ll update this again when the swap is complete.

Oh yeah, this (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/stromberg.gif) is gonna be good!

[MecGen]

Sweet (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smilie_pokal.gif)

Ya its frikken cold here too...
I remember that you were having vibration problems...I was kinda hoping it worked out for you.
The 4.1 is a hard choice to beat tho (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ar15.gif)

Thanx for the 914 porn and thinking outside of the box.
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/clap.gif)

Later

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/beer.gif)

[dbledsoe]

QUOTE (MecGen @ Jan 19 2006, 06:29 PM)

Sweet   (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smilie_pokal.gif) Ya its frikken cold here too... I remember that you were having vibration problems...I was kinda hoping it worked out for you. The 4.1 is a hard choice to beat tho    :shoot2kill: Thanx for the 914 porn and thinking outside of the box. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/clap.gif) Later (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/beer.gif)

MecGen,

I've photgraphed through the entire conversion and will post it all to my 914world.com blog as I get the chance.

Thank you for the compliments. Agreed, the V6 conversion isn't much welcomed here amongst the type four groupies (0r so it seems), but then I consider them to be gluttons for punishment (I paid my type four dues and it sucked!). My V6 conversion, in spite of its problems, has been ran hard and then has set in the garage for the winter without a single drop of oil leaking from it. It starts on the first or second revolution (as it did when I first fired it up) in low teen temperatures and idles like a dream. Need a bit of a thrill, step on the gas and you'll get plenty! Can't wait for the 4.1! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/driving.gif) I can only imagine what the small block Chevy conversion guys experience, but it's gotta be incredible! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smiley_notworthy.gif)

[budman5201]

Hey whats the horsepower on your engine and weight compared to my subaru 2.0 turbo??? Very curious. oh can you pm me with answer so i dont miss it??
thanks!