Piston oil squirters for a /4...anyone have them? Options

[McMark]

Here's that mod.

The real Porsche squirters have a ball check valve inside. This closes the squirters at idle and maintains oil pressure. IMHO there is no other option.

[McMark]

Check valve opens around 20psi.

[r_towle]

Check valve opens around 20psi.

Umm, not always (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

So a friend came over today to try and get some squirters functioning, seems they get clogged or just stop opening...
Looks like a tough thing to fix, it's drilled in, then it looks like the squirters are peeled over in the 911 case....

I wonder, are there any threaded ones out there?

Mark, thanks for that pic, please document this mod, I will be doing it when I pull the motor apart this winter.....cause I just can't leave it alone, and I need to change out the camshaft.....so while I am in there, this seems like a very good idea to help out.

Rich

[Mark Henry]

I've cut notches in rods, I'd say it likely slings rather than squirts, but oil pressure has always been fine and I'm guessing it helps.

I've also replaced 911 squirters, it not a hard job at all, just on the wallet, those puppies are about $50 ea IIRC. Make sure you test them first they are likely fine. They can stick open or closed, seafoam or MEK will often free them up. Careful with MEK if you use it, nasty stuff.

I don't really like the squriter in rod mod, I wouldn't do it.

[McMark]

911 squirters are often replaced as a peace-of-mind repair. AFAIK, the factory installed 911 squirters are pressed in from the bearing side so removal is just a matter or tapping them back out. The quick retrofit version is to dril from the case register, tap them in and peen them over. But you should be able to tap them out with a rod inserted from the bearing side of the hole.

I'll be doing it the factory way which leaves a little seat material to keep the squirters from popping out.

[JimN73]

Somebody, Nate (aircoledtechguy), posted a photo of this. Maybe he can repost.

[wndsnd]

911 squirters are often replaced as a peace-of-mind repair. AFAIK, the factory installed 911 squirters are pressed in from the bearing side so removal is just a matter or tapping them back out. The quick retrofit version is to dril from the case register, tap them in and peen them over. But you should be able to tap them out with a rod inserted from the bearing side of the hole.

I'll be doing it the factory way which leaves a little seat material to keep the squirters from popping out.

Not sure about this Mark, from the bearing side these are probably over 2" down their bore.
I would say the factory pressed in from the cylinder side and gave them a peen for good measure.

John

[Mark Henry]

911 squirters are often replaced as a peace-of-mind repair. AFAIK, the factory installed 911 squirters are pressed in from the bearing side so removal is just a matter or tapping them back out. The quick retrofit version is to dril from the case register, tap them in and peen them over. But you should be able to tap them out with a rod inserted from the bearing side of the hole.

I'll be doing it the factory way which leaves a little seat material to keep the squirters from popping out.

Not sure about this Mark, from the bearing side these are probably over 2" down their bore.
I would say the factory pressed in from the cylinder side and gave them a peen for good measure.

John

The one case half it's impossible to go from the backside and the passages don't go from the bearings, the case half stud holes doubles as oil galleys, that's where they are fed from.
They are barely pressed in if at all, the peen does it all. You just drill the peens off and jam a screw in and a small slide hammer then pop it out easy-peasy. Drop the new one in and three new peens lock it in.

BUT if they are working fine I see absolutely no reason to replace them, other than to waste money.
Also you can easily test them to see if they are working proper.
BTDT

[DBCooper]

I've never seen the rod notch in person and I'm doubtful it's effective at squirting.

It's detailed in a VW tech bulletin, one (of several) that also recommend elimination of the aluminum/copper head gaskets. A copy here; http://www.ratwell.com/mirror/www.dolphins...m/techbull.html

I don't know why they wouldn't work. Pretty straightforward, cheap, easy to do, won't clog, shouldn't affect oil pressure and they'll be slinging oil as long as you have it. Nothing really to lose, I don't see a down side.

It's neat to see these old threads come up again with names that haven't been around for a while. Like old friends showing up.

[McMark]

I don't know why they wouldn't work. Pretty straightforward, cheap, easy to do, won't clog, shouldn't affect oil pressure and they'll be slinging oil as long as you have it. Nothing really to lose, I don't see a down side.

Oil pressure is based on a certain amount of restriction in the system. The more restriction, the higher the oil pressure. And the opposite is true. So if you notch your rods, you're adding a drain to the system and it will lower oil pressure somewhat. BUT if VW recommended it, there is a certain amount of confidence about doing the mod.

But my armchair-engineering makes me think that a V notch in the rod isn't an effective 'squirter' since I don't see how it could squirt. It'll throw more oil at the piston in a sloppy, brute-force manner.

I think a true squirter, aimed correctly and which shuts itself off when oil pressure is low is a much better approach.

[Dave_Darling]

"Better", of course! But is the notch "good enough"? Is it an improvement over no notch? I'm guessing it is at least an improvement...

--DD

[DBCooper]

Yeah, it would be great to know VW's engineering data, but I can't see that it would lower oil pressure all that much. It's a 'v' notch, with the outlet to the rod side clearance way down at the point of the 'v', so it's actually pretty small. By the time the oil gets there it's already past the bearing shell and escaping anyway, so it seems like this is mostly just providing one point as an outlet instead of the whole circumference of the journal, so oil that before was flung out randomly is now kind of concentrated on the back of the piston. "kind of" concentrated, so definitely not as precise as squirter nozzles, but not bad in terms of bang for the buck.

[rudedude]

They might be great until your 6 cylinder isn't at quite the oil pressure it use to be and you drain the oil and find most of a squirter laying in the bottom of the case. Now time for a total teardown and rebuild for that peened in squirter that porsche couldn't quite peen well enough to hold in.

[r_towle]

Seems doing this modification to the big end might just be easier and well, easier.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7wuNuuEoN7Y

[r_towle]

Interesting
Carrillo Rods do this modification also

http://www.cp-carrillo.com/tech/rodtech/ta...76/default.aspx

[McMark]

Took a look at a spare case today. Looks like a pretty straightforward mod. Now to order a set and do a mockup install. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sunglasses.gif)

[r_towle]

From what I read, it is not straight...

A slight angle from the seat to the squirters to get it aimed correctly.

Please take a few pics of how you machine it.....looks like a hairy thing to drill

[ChrisFoley]

Notching the rods is simple and effective.

[aircooledtechguy]

Notching the rods is simple and effective.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Takes about 2 minutes per rod with a fine triangle file.



Oil is lazy just like air and will take the path of least resistance. Give it a pathway and you'll have a cheap and effective stream of oil at the base of your piston. Basically you're funneling the oil that would otherwise splash off the rod from the rod bearing and directing a portion of that splash where you want it at the piston crown.

[r_towle]

One of the things I saw, which I can't seem to find again, showed a notch on both sides, offset to spray in different directions.
So instead of the notch being at 6 o'clock, it was at 7 on one side and 5 on the other side....so it would spray both ways.