1971 Gold Metallic Project, The Turbo 1.7 Options

[kevin311]

I love this thread. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)
I have been gathering parts to do this also, after I finish my ITBs. Im already running MSII and I have a really small turbo from an old volvo that I used on my T1 sandrail with SS oil feed and drain lines.
This thread is making me really anxious to get to work!

Great work! Really an inspiration!

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) Kevin

[McMark]

I was struck by how driveable it was. This isn't a beast that you couldn't talk your wife into riding in. It retains the character of the 1.7 but has an "I want to go play" attitude.
I can just imagine how nice this would be with a freshly built balanced engine and a good quiet well flowing muffler. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

With the right heads... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif)

I've been pondering the engine build. Definitely have to stay 1.7 because everything is matched to that. The bottom end would stay pretty much the same, but some head work could open things up. The 1.7 heads are pretty restricting. Maybe just using 1.8 heads would work better. I could do 2.0 heads but would need some tweaking because the intake system is based on 1.7 four bolt runners. Or 2.0 heads with four studs (did someone say LE200? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) ). According to Corky Bell's book, stock cams are actually really good for turboing. Not sure if I would want to risk the unknown effects by swapping to another cam. Part of the drivability is the copious idle vacuum, which goes away if I run a cam with overlap. Sure, I gain top end, but I'm not looking for that. But if I build this new engine, it'll be balanced in every respect. I've been wanting to build a crazy blueprinted engine for awhile now, and I think this is the build to do it on.

The muffler is a 3" inlet/outlet Hooker Header muffler. It's huge. If anything is restricting the exhaust flow it's the turbo. I'm tempted to try the K04, but I'm also liking just driving my car. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

And then there's always that slippery slope of adding more boost. ottox914 is running 12+psi. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) I think I'm afraid of this though, to be honest. There are so many turbo horror stories out there. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

[McMark]

I love this thread. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)
I have been gathering parts to do this also, after I finish my ITBs. Im already running MSII and I have a really small turbo from an old volvo that I used on my T1 sandrail with SS oil feed and drain lines.
This thread is making me really anxious to get to work!

Great work! Really an inspiration!

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) Kevin

Thanks! Go for it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif) And keep us posted... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Chris H.]

...The 1.7 heads are pretty restricting. Maybe just using 1.8 heads would work better....Part of the drivability is the copious idle vacuum, which goes away if I run a cam with overlap. Sure, I gain top end, but I'm not looking for that. But if I build this new engine, it'll be balanced in every respect. I've been wanting to build a crazy blueprinted engine for awhile now, and I think this is the build to do it on.

Now you're killing me...I'll have a 1.8 left over from my transplant....hmmmmm... maybe I won't sell it.

BTW Mark I think I have a set of original blue California license plates from a 1971 Fastback...bought it in the late '80's and registered it here so they should be long gone out of the system by now. You can have them if you want. Would be perfect for your gold teener rebuild. 341 are the first 3 digits of the plate to confirm....I read somewhere the plate has to be from the same year car to reuse them.

[McMark]

Thanks Chris. From what I've read that plate process only applied to 1969 and earlier car. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) But I suppose it would be worth it to put the paperwork through anyway might get lucky. I would love it to be blue plates...

[Chris H.]

Thanks Chris. From what I've read that plate process only applied to 1969 and earlier car. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) But I suppose it would be worth it to put the paperwork through anyway might get lucky. I would love it to be blue plates...

PM me your address... I'll dig them out this weekend. At the very least you can slap them on at meets. I'll never use them.

[SirAndy]

I could do ...

Don't ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

The thing that makes this so interesting is the fact that it would be a bolt on solution to a *STOCK* 1.7L engine!

And there are so many of them out there. If you can make this work with a stock cam and stock heads and be able to sell it as a complete kit, you will be way ahead.

Once people have to split the case or even just swap heads, you lost 2/3 of your customer base right there.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

[effutuo101]

I have a couple of small SUBY turbos if you think they would help a build. VF31 and VF 32. They can off my twin turbo motor, and I am going to a single screw set up.

[McMark]

So... I learned today that my gas gauge doesn't go below 1/4 tank.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/hide.gif)

Luckily I ran out of gas basically in Trekkor's driveway. I owe ya big time, buddy. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[Mike Bellis]

You could always run E85. Stays cooler at higher boost levels. less detonation...

[ConeDodger]

I was struck by how driveable it was. This isn't a beast that you couldn't talk your wife into riding in. It retains the character of the 1.7 but has an "I want to go play" attitude.
I can just imagine how nice this would be with a freshly built balanced engine and a good quiet well flowing muffler. : (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif) driving:

With the right heads... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif)

There are so many turbo horror stories out there. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

Turn up the boost. The worst horror you can do at this point is scatter a throw-away 1.7 all over the pavement. 7psi is factory turbo street car range. 12 is still pretty casual... You know the first step to recovery is admitting you want more boost!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif)

[r_towle]

I could do ...

Don't ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

The thing that makes this so interesting is the fact that it would be a bolt on solution to a *STOCK* 1.7L engine!

And there are so many of them out there. If you can make this work with a stock cam and stock heads and be able to sell it as a complete kit, you will be way ahead.

Once people have to split the case or even just swap heads, you lost 2/3 of your customer base right there.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

[Chris H.]

This could be interesting for Bay Window bus owners too. They aren't looking for massive boost, just a little more ooomph to push those toasters around.

[McMark]

Put in the new spark plugs. Didn't notice a difference.
Installed a new CHT sensor so I can turn cold start enrichment back on.

Still fighting some pinging. Sunday I'm going to pull out 10 degrees of timing and just see if it's possible to make it stop. If that doesn't work I need to sit down and think about what's causing this problem. Could be that the spark plugs are still too hot. Could be that the MS is doing something odd or the coils I'm using aren't up to it.

I also found out (by actually looking) that my engine is 8.2:1 compression, it's a W code engine. This is higher than I thought, but comparing it to other turbo engines out there it isn't out of line. ottox914 is running ~9:1 and 12+ psi of boost. I have a feeling something more than just tuning is the issue. I honestly don't expect pulling timing to make any difference, and the AFR while pinging is 10 to 1. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

[messix]

when is it pining?

high load lower rpm, high load high rpm?

[McMark]

Pretty much anytime over 3/4 throttle (2600 RPM and above)

[monkeyboy]

Possible sharp edge in the head getting too hot?

[McMark]

Possible. Who knows. Gotta eliminate the tuning possibility first.

[messix]

you might have to add a boost indexed ign retard

[McMark]

Yeah, I've got a Spark Advance MAP I play with. I'm also going to try pulling the coil dwell time down from the currect 3.8ms setting to 2.5ms and see what kinds of effects that has. These coils are generic manufacturer coils, so I'm thinking that a much lower dwell may be necessary to keep the coils happy. I've already pulled about 8 degrees of timing and it's already running rich, and I'm only pushing 5psi of boost.