Easy 5-Lug Conversion - 911 Running Gear, For High Power Applications... Options

[Eric_Shea]

First, hats off to Paul (our previous cover-boy and Excellence darling) for turning the bulb on. We were chatting one day about CV's and such and he said something to the effect of; "just get the right length axles and be done with it."

Well duh.

Just get the right length axles and be done with it. No adapters. No extra bolts. No machining, no issues. Just get the right length axles and be done with it. It had a nice ring to it.

I was on a mission. The mission began with a post to get the proper 914 axle length - 20.25" (thanks Ron). Then the 911 spline count - 28. Then a call to Sway-a-Way... yup, part number 2420 in stock. MSRP - $305.00 Not bad, not bad at all for a pair of custom length axles. http://www.swayaway.com/OffRoadRacing.php

I want to make this harder than it is but honestly gang... it's that simple. Simply get the entire early 911 running gear and insert the proper length axle and you're done. Well, there are a few steps so let's see just what that gear is. From stem to stern it goes like this...

From a pre1974 911:

* 911 Rear Wheel Hub
* 911 Stub Axles
* Entire 911 Axle Assembly w/CV's
* 911 Tranny Flanges (901, 911 or early 915 transmissions)

I had the hubs, I grabbed the axles off a buy Reid made (Lavanaut, thanks!) and I picked up some flanges on eBay or PP (can't remember, getting old before your eyes). All I needed were those axles. All it took was money. While I waited for the axles I got started on the disassembly.

Dusty dirty axles... one of the messiest jobs:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232675907.jpg)

Using an air wrench... bolts coming out:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232675899.jpg)

Here's you'll see my method for stub axle removal. A BFH and a cold chisel. Be careful to position the cold chisel on the "gasket" between the CV and the stub axle to avoid cranking on the metal bits:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232675929.jpg)

They're here. Shiny new axles:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232675956.jpg)

The right length too. You can see the difference when compared to the 911 units:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232675941.jpg)

The threesome. Short = 911. The loaded shaft is a 914 shaft:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232675995.jpg)

I want to emphasize the difference because you simply can't run 911 axles in a 914 (for very long). People have bolted them up but, they hyper extend the CV's and they're gonners in a short while.

Remember all that dirty stuff in the first pics? Well, I make a weekly run to the platers so, my rewards are as follows:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676018.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676029.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676039.jpg)

Speaking of dirty stuff, the CV's needed to be totally disassembled and cleaned. To do this I stuck them in a gallon of that Gunk Carb Cleaner for a week. This is the best way to loosen hardened, caked on grease. When they came out it still took a couple rolls of shop towels to get them cleaned up. Once everything was cleaned it was assembly time. Not too tough really:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676161.jpg)

Start by fitting the inner race into the cage:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676177.jpg)

Then pop the balls in one by one:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676188.jpg)

Then drop the inner assembly into the CV. Simply match up the fat notch on the inside race with the skinny notch on the outside race to line up the path for the balls:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676221.jpg)

Then tilt it back and drop it in:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676247.jpg)

You may have to do a bit of rotating to make it easier but it's fairly straight forward:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676259.jpg)

Ready for the lube:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676320.jpg)

I start by putting the nozzle of the grease tube in the inner ball slots and filling away:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676342.jpg)

Inside started:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676427.jpg)

Then I do the outside the same way:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676380.jpg)

Flip them over and repeat. You do have latex gloves don't you? Once they are loaded you have to massage them by hand to work the grease throughout the joint. TAKE YOUR TIME and get the grease thoroughly into the CV. Notice the Moly-Lube? I use an entire tube for each CV. It's the good stuff.

Now the fun part... bolting it all back together. Here the CV's have new boots and freshly plated top plates:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676292.jpg)

Next the CV's get installed and clipped into place. Once the plates are in place it's time for new boot clips:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676443.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676459.jpg)

New bolts are made ready with new Schnorr washers:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676474.jpg)

...and a new CV gasket is mated to the CV awaiting the stub axle to be bolted on:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676506.jpg)

A quick referrence to the "good book" and let the torquing commence:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676864.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676520.jpg)

And we're done:
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-1110-1232676926.jpg)

911 hubs go in the control arms. These shiny stub axles go into the hubs. The shiny nuts get torqued down and the other end gets a gasket and is bolted up to the transmission flanges.

Virtually bullet proof 911 CV's and a complete 5-lug conversion now reside under your 914.

[Gint]

I saw the pics in the BO. Nice...

914 axle shafts make great t-nut installation tools inside a wooden box. I spent the afternoon building a small router table.

T-nuts (I literally used a 914 axle shaft to pound them into the underside of a 14" square particle board box):

(IMG:http://www.fastenersuperstore.com/stores/superstore/images/4prongTeeNuts.jpg)

This post has been edited by Gint: Jan 22 2009, 09:35 PM

[Eric_Shea]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

[Todd Enlund]

Sweet!

[Aaron Cox]

Those are some nice.....balls eric..... LOL

Good work chap. Im still holding out for the 944 option

[kconway]

Eric,
I'm wondering about the orientation of the inner race. Not sure this matters or not but I thought the chamfered inner edge would be flipped over from the way shown in your photo so to except the driveshaft when inserted into the CV. I found it harder to insert the shaft when not putting it into the chamfered side. Also, there is a washer that goes on the shaft that is somewhat conical. Which direction does that washer face?
Kev

[Gint]

Eric,
I'm wondering about the orientation of the inner race. Not sure this matters or not but I thought the chamfered inner edge would be flipped over from the way shown in your photo so to except the driveshaft when inserted into the CV. I found it harder to insert the shaft when not putting it into the chamfered side. Also, there is a washer that goes on the shaft that is somewhat conical. Which direction does that washer face?
Kev

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) What he said. I didn't nice that before. Shouldn't that go the other way?

[Gint]

While I'm here, no groove for a retaining ring on the inside of the new axle shafts? No worries about the shaft floating out? Theoretically there shouldn't be an issue. but... a question for the hell of it.

[PeeGreen 914]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif)

[sixnotfour]

Jon, just paint your shafts orange.

[PeeGreen 914]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif) I was thinking salmon would be fetching on them (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[JRust]

Eric you showed me these a few months back. I definately need to get them on my car this spring. Moving my tranny back 1 1/2 to accomodate my firewall a little better. Then my 911 axles will really be short. Maybe I should have you get a set ready for me CV's on & all (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

[PanelBilly]

Thanks alot, now I have another item to add to the must have list.

[TC 914-8]

Thanks alot, now I have another item to add to the must have list.

Yep, Billy is right, this how it starts, Eric makes an excelent, "how to thread" and it gets added to the never ending list.
The last time Eric posted a caliper rebuild thread it cost me 500 bucks or more.

Thanks Eric, Great thread (IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif)

I did some AC work for Sway-away years ago. I wish I knew then, I was going to need some of their products, now.

TI

[Eric_Shea]

I thought the chamfered inner edge would be flipped over from the way shown in your photo

Both edges were chamfered on the 911 CV's.

[Eric_Shea]

While I'm here, no groove for a retaining ring on the inside of the new axle shafts? No worries about the shaft floating out?

Nada. It was explained to me that it was actually "healthier" for the CV to have a floating axle.

Paul has a similar setup on his 3.6. I'll let him weigh in here as well. His utilizes the later hubs with the centering ring. I believe he's using different CV's as well. All the same though... get the right length axles and the world is your oyster here.

Also, there is a washer that goes on the shaft that is somewhat conical. Which direction does that washer face?

This relates to Gint's question as well. The standard axles have a shelf that prevents the CV and axle from "full-floating" the Porsche axles do a semi-float because of this. This shelf is where your conical washer would normally go. With the Sway-a-Way axles they are allowed to full-float. This allows the CV's to find their natural center and actually handle more torque. This is a "biggy" with the off-road crowd.

[Eric_Shea]

Moving my tranny back 1 1/2 to accomodate my firewall a little better. Then my 911 axles will really be short.

http://www.swayaway.com/OffRoadRacing.php

Check Model 2421. It might be right for you. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Steve]

Paul used 108mm CV's, does anyone know by chance the part number of the transmission flange that works with the 108mm CV's? Can this flange work with both the 914 and 915 trans?
Thanks for the help!!!

[Eric_Shea]

Those are actually 108's as well... I'll see if I can pull a number. You could Google Porsche Parts PDF and get it there. Use a 70-73 911 as an example (probably earlier as well but, not sure on the cutoff).

[Steve]

According to the PET I came up with this list for the tranny flange
65-69 901.332.209.12
70 901.332.209.15 Chilled cast
70 901.332.209.21 Pressure cast
71 911.332.209.00
72-73 915.332.209.01
74-77 915.332.209.01
According to an old mid america catalog it lists the following:
7/68-9/71 108mm CV
1/75-86 100mm CV
87-89 100mm CV diferent part number than the 75-86 part number.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)