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> Its Suspension Time!, anyone with tips tricks?
cha914
post Jan 14 2003, 11:52 AM
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Starting friday I will be pulling the suspension off the 914 and

- installing Koni sports all around with the fully adj perches in the rear

-new poly bushings all around (from weltmeister...street compound)

-turbo tie rod kit

-new ball joints

...anyway...this is the last part of the 914 that I haven't pulled off the car yet, so its time. any, tips, hints that you have will be much appreciated. I am going to be doing this with the help of a lift and plenty of tools...so I am hoping to knock this out over the weekend...doable?

Thanks,

Tony
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Bleyseng
post Jan 14 2003, 02:24 PM
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Brad is having a class this saturday on front suspension work,if you can make it. Lookin the events calendar
Geoff
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J P Stein
post Jan 14 2003, 02:32 PM
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Are those gas shox?
If not, the fronts are a stinker to get back up thru the hole in the strut mount.
You will also find your tie rod ends reluctant to let go of the strut. I good tie rod puller is necessary and one of these (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smash.gif)
Removing the tie rod from the steering rack is a challenge.
I used a monster pair of channel lock pliers. Access is a bitch.
Light a fire for the removal of the rubber bushings (a butane/propane torch).
Clean the bejesus out of the surfaces that the bushing ride on. .....I mean shiney clean.
Don't forget to bleed the brakes...set the venting clearances....yada.
Big freakin pipe wrench .....with cheater bar, for ball joint nut removal. Installation of the nut is *supposed* to be done with a torque wrench (165 ft/lbs) and the special tool that fits the nut.

There's more.....


As to the time frame. If you can work 20 hour days, eat no food , drink no beer, take no breaks, encounter no problems, take no time to pee (remember, no beer), have all the right tools close at hand, keep off the effin puter, AND make all the right moves....sure, peice of cake.
First time for the suspenders, eh?
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cha914
post Jan 14 2003, 03:06 PM
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MUSR 8 - 5lug conversion done wed - drive 500miles thrus
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Unfortunately the drive to CA and back from TX would take most of the rest of the week and weekend, but I would love to attend (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

JP - thanks for the tips...most sound familiar as I have read about many others doing the same, but this is the first time for me, and I know that its always different when you are the one under the car...

I don't need to finish this weekend, but it would be nice...
I am also planning brake work (new ss lines and adj prop valve), and I am not worried about them...done alot of brake stuff before...just never touched the suspension before.

can you take the steering rack out from the car to mess with it or is that a bad idea?

And what do you suggest as far as an alignment after such a weekend?

Thanks,

Tony

PS...Brad, I know you have said something before about cutting groves in the poly bushings to keep grease in them...got any pics?
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Jeroen
post Jan 14 2003, 03:37 PM
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How the fuck do you get the friggin struts off the balljoint?
(not the balljoint off the a-arm)

YES, it did remove the crossbolt and sprayed about a full can of "liquid wrench" on them already.

Is there a special tool, or do I just go at it with a bigger f-ing hamer?

Cheers,

Jeroen
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bhfast
post Jan 14 2003, 03:48 PM
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ball joint seperator it looks like a big fork, but with only 2 prongs.
brian
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bhfast
post Jan 14 2003, 03:49 PM
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local auto parts store should have it for around $7
brian
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J P Stein
post Jan 14 2003, 03:52 PM
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I didn't mean to sound rude.
I take a much more casual approach to working on the car.....
that way, I have a chance to spend more money on it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)
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Jeroen
post Jan 14 2003, 03:53 PM
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I got that one... won't work on the strut/balljoint

Couldn't get the tie-rods off with it either.
I used a different tool for the tie-rods.
I was scared the tool would break (not good if it's a loaner), but the tie-rod gave first

Darn, this stuff can get stuck!

Cheers,

Jeroen
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bhfast
post Jan 14 2003, 03:58 PM
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when i did mine it didjn't work either, so i used heat a beat the crap out of it with a hammer since i was replacing the balljoints anyway (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smash.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ar15.gif)
finally it ended up coming off
brian (IMG:style_emoticons/default/clap56.gif)
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Brad Roberts
post Jan 14 2003, 04:31 PM
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Here is how to get the ball joint out of the struts.

Use the torsion bars.

Pull the pin out of the bottom of the strut.

With the car on jackstands, place youre floorjack under the brake rotor hub.. not the actual rotor. Jack it up until you just start to see the car come off the jack stands. NOW. Hit the control arm with a 3lb sledge right next too the ball joint. The spring tension of the torsion bars and the 3lb sledge will have the control arm out of the strut very quickly. Remember that you can twist the struts out of your way.. you will have plenty of room to swing the hammer. I personally use a air chisel with a blunt end on it.

Please dont think anything will fly apart. You are just barely using the torsion bar tension to help with this (the full weight of the car is not on it)

This works. Dont let anybody tell you it doesnt. I leave the struts in the car and pull the control arms off the car. I then put the control arms back on the car and reassemble everything when I get the new bushings/bearings and torsion bars in them. THEN I do the shocks. I never completely remove the strut assemblies.

There is also NO need to remove the steering rack bolts. I only loosen the two large 19mm bolts that hold the rack in.. I dont even remove the splash shield unless I'm doing Turbo Tie rods.

B
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cha914
post Jan 14 2003, 04:33 PM
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I didn't take anything as rude...just want to enjoy this car for a change...and finally get it on the track after so long.

I really just wanted to get an estimate of how long it could take...so when its 4am on sat night I know I am close or I should just go to bed (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

and all you guys talking about needle bearings and monoball setups is making me want to spend ALOT more money than I should on this car...I just keep telling myself that I should put on the parts I have and upgrade later when I actually have some seat time in the car...crazy how these thousand dollar cars can get so expensive.

Tony
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Bleyseng
post Jan 14 2003, 04:37 PM
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Yeah, the ball joints get rusted in place to the strut so ya gotta use JP's method-BFH and heat. I also have a BFPB (Bigfuckingprybar) even 2 sizes (3 or 4 footer)that helps a lot too. Taking your time on this kind of project avoids making serious mistakes, like breaking or bending stuff. I like to clean up and repaint the parts as I go too. I know JP does look at all the pics he sends, the parts are like new before he re-installs em.
On the tie rod removeal, back the nut off so just a hair is past the threaded part. Then use the BFH lightly to break it loose from the strut. This is if you are saving the tie rod otherwise hit it good and hard.

Time for some in depth tech articles with pics it sounds like for this BBS.....


Geoff
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Brad Roberts
post Jan 14 2003, 04:38 PM
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Tony.

With proper tools.. I takes me 8 hours to completely do front and rear suspension on a 914. This is drive it in and roll it out for alignment.

Dont burn the rubber out if you have a press. It takes me 15minutes per side on the front control arms to push off the old ones. The rear takes about 30 minutes per side to push them out.

B
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Brad Roberts
post Jan 14 2003, 04:40 PM
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I dont use heat.. ever. Your lower ball joints dont always need replacing... so I dont use heat. It cooks the grease and melts the rubber protector.

B
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cha914
post Jan 14 2003, 04:56 PM
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ok...thats good info...I will plan on at least double your time since its my first try.

Brad...you also mentioned earlier how you cut groves into the poly bushings to hold the grease...you got any pics of this?

Thanks for the help,

Tony
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Bleyseng
post Jan 14 2003, 05:14 PM
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Well if you use too friggin much heat! Just a little on the strut so it expands and breaks the rust bond.
I like your method of using the torsion bars to help, have to try that one next time.
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Brad Roberts
post Jan 14 2003, 05:24 PM
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I tried to take pics of it... but none of them turned out. Just make a spiral path down the inside of them with something resembling a Dremel tool. I use a air grinder and carbide tip. Takes about 10 minutes per bushing. It really helps keep the grease in them. For what little material your removing..it will not compromise the structural integrety of the bushing. I cut the groove about half the thickness of a pencil (maybe a tad less). Just enough to hold the grease while you slide them on.

B
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cha914
post Jan 14 2003, 05:30 PM
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Ok...I have a little dremel...

how deep of a cut...from your description you just barely break the surface, correct?

Tony
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Brad Roberts
post Jan 14 2003, 05:33 PM
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Umm.. half the thickness of a No.2 Pencil (the yellow ones) This is a little more than breaking the surface.

The Dremel will take more time.. but not much. You can start on the bushings this week. Just sit dow with all of them in hand...


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