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> SCCA catagory for my 914-4, racing catagory 914
FastFroggy
post Apr 29 2024, 12:40 PM
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Hello all,

I previously ran HPDE events and autocrosses prior to my engine issue. I am now wrapping up my 914-4 rebuild and just passed my SCCA Licensing Class. Really enjoy running the car. Would like to see if there is an SCCA class I can fit it, but looks tough. Looking for guidance on the best path forward given my stated priorities:

1. SCCA regional level minimum
2. Extent of further modification needed
3. Relative competitiveness in class

My car:
a. 1973 914-4 with up to date safety items(Cage, extinguisher, seats, harness, etc)
b. 2.0l stock internals
c. race headers
d. large bore twin carbs
e. 5 lug conversion
f. 911 1973 rotors
g. 911s calipers front
h. fiberglass fender flares

Please PM me with feedback. Thanks, GregM
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GregAmy
post May 8 2024, 06:53 AM
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The whole open-top/closed-top thing is a PITA and SCCA refuses to clearly define it. I asked last Fall for a explicit definition to be added to the GCR Technical glossary but it was denied; I suspect it's because of some conflicting prep regs (which is why I requested it) and they don't want to step into that pile.

The only reference I can find to the intent is GCR 9.3.18, Driver's Restraint System, "Arm restraints are required on all open cars including open Targa tops, sunroofs and T-tops."

This implies, but does not define, that a targa car with the top off is "open" (which requires arm restraints) and with it on it's "closed" (which requires a window net).

GCR 9.3.17 refers to Detachable Panels/Sunroofs, implying that targa tops must be removed, however it also states, "Movable or removable metal or composite panels in the roof may be either removed or positively secured in the closed position." But then, "Any openings in the roof resulting from the removal of a panel must be covered..."

"Well, which is it, young feller? You want I should freeze or get down on the ground?" (name that movie reference...)

The Production regs allow, but do not require, cutting of the windshield and removal of the rear glass (9.1.5.E.9.a.8.A, "Open cars may remove the windshield glass, door window glass, quarter window glass, rear glass, vent glass...If removed, a replacement windshield must be installed...) This is the regs that was intorturated back in the 70s to "replace" the windshield and frame with the now-well-known "Ginther Windshield".

If would seem, by general practice, that SCCA thus considers targa-top-equipped cars as open top for the purpose of this reg, as no one that I'm aware of has ever been bounced for Ginthering a Porsche 914. 'Specially since Ginther was probably the first one to do that.

So if you pop the targa top, whether or not you choose not to cut the windshield, then you're an open car (and its associated regs requirements).

Unsurprisingly, the GT regs say nothing about open top versus closed top cars. The inconsistency is palpable...and frustrating. But GT regs are so permissive now that it doesn't matter, no one will care.

Frankly, unless you're willing to go the whole Ginther route, it's preferable from an aerodynamics perspective to leave the roof on. But given the really bad aero we have with that rear roof deck, if you get serious about aero you'd want to go full Ginther.

I think a Ginthered 914 looks cool. I keep wanting to do that to mine but Chris keeps talking me out of it...and points me to the chassis he has for sale that's already done.

EDIT: if you're interested in the aero, this is an interesting discussion: http://www.cassidy-online.com/porsche914/a...aids/index.html
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FastFroggy   SCCA catagory for my 914-4   Apr 29 2024, 12:40 PM
GregAmy   Oh boy, big long discussion...but let's start ...   Apr 30 2024, 07:16 AM
GregAmy   Some updates. I'm reviewing the regs, and the...   Apr 30 2024, 08:14 AM
FastFroggy   Thank you GregA, Lots of good info. I have been ...   Apr 30 2024, 11:03 AM
GregAmy   I'll PM you to continue the discussion if that...   Apr 30 2024, 02:31 PM
ChrisFoley   Regarding fuel cells, my Production car custom fue...   Apr 30 2024, 12:32 PM
BillJ   If going racing (circuit course not autox) then ge...   Apr 30 2024, 12:39 PM
FastFroggy   BillJ, you bring up a very good point. The 914 is ...   Apr 30 2024, 04:19 PM
GregAmy   Previously ITA logbook(lost to time) out in Colora...   Apr 30 2024, 08:11 PM
brant   You should probably show us a picture I might ev...   Apr 30 2024, 07:01 PM
ChrisFoley   EP will restrict you to 7x15 wheels, 40mm carbs, a...   May 1 2024, 04:48 AM
GregAmy   Chris, we have a new brake rule in Prod, think it ...   May 1 2024, 06:50 AM
FastFroggy   Thanks for all the insight. Really appreciate it. ...   May 1 2024, 06:54 AM
GregAmy   Do you have your schools signed off yet? What...   May 1 2024, 07:49 AM
FastFroggy   Yes, I have my school signed off. Plan is to hav...   May 1 2024, 08:40 AM
ChrisFoley   914-6 has vented front and solid rear rotors. Usin...   May 1 2024, 10:59 AM
FastFroggy   batter batter swing..... on photos. Will take a da...   May 1 2024, 02:51 PM
Charles Freeborn   ... then there's vintage. You'd be in VP2 ...   May 3 2024, 08:21 PM
brant   ... then there's vintage. You'd be in VP2...   May 4 2024, 07:32 AM
GregAmy   what is the displacement again? For historics raci...   May 5 2024, 07:04 AM
Charles Freeborn   [quote name='Charles Freeborn' post='3143151' dat...   May 5 2024, 09:03 PM
brant   No matter what sanctioning body Classes often incl...   May 5 2024, 09:24 AM
FastFroggy   Just noticed that I missed a few questions. a. y...   May 6 2024, 05:38 AM
FastFroggy   Thanks again for all who are contributing. Been ...   May 6 2024, 03:24 PM
GregAmy   ...I am considering to class the car in GT3. I wou...   May 7 2024, 07:09 AM
Charles Freeborn   Your SCCA license will work for pretty much any am...   May 6 2024, 09:06 PM
FastFroggy   Hope this finally works, will get photos of the fr...   May 7 2024, 07:24 AM
GregAmy   >>> I'd need to see your cage... Loo...   May 7 2024, 08:33 AM
moto914   Great thread.   May 7 2024, 10:20 AM
FastFroggy   Thanks for the clarity of feedback. I have a follo...   May 7 2024, 12:47 PM
GregAmy   Arm Restraints are required for the Targa, but it ...   May 7 2024, 01:27 PM
ChrisFoley   IIRC, in the production classes, if you remove the...   May 7 2024, 02:41 PM
groot   You're local to me... and if I recall, you may...   May 7 2024, 05:38 PM
brant   Nice to see you here kevin   May 7 2024, 05:46 PM
groot   Thanks, Brant... I stalk every once in a while... ...   May 7 2024, 05:54 PM
GregAmy   The whole open-top/closed-top thing is a PITA and ...   May 8 2024, 06:53 AM
gms   you might want to check out VSCDA and Midwestern ...   May 8 2024, 09:36 AM
FastFroggy   GregAmy, Somewhat glad to hear I was the only one ...   May 8 2024, 11:57 AM
Charles Freeborn   Fun looking car. Similar to my last one built by A...   May 9 2024, 10:43 AM
infraredcalvin   Raising Arizona :lol4: @GregAmy   May 10 2024, 09:18 PM
Charles Freeborn   Raising Arizona :lol4: [b]@[url=http://www.91...   May 11 2024, 10:12 PM
GregAmy   :beer2:   May 11 2024, 05:33 AM
FastFroggy   Progress from Saturday: engine and trans finally b...   May 16 2024, 09:02 AM
FastFroggy   Does anyone know where I can find the missing chok...   May 16 2024, 09:03 AM
ChrisFoley   Does anyone know where I can find the missing cho...   May 18 2024, 12:47 PM
FastFroggy   Does anyone know where I can find the missing ch...   May 20 2024, 06:46 AM
FastFroggy   update from this weekend: Still needs tidying up...   May 16 2024, 09:03 AM
FastFroggy   oops..   May 16 2024, 09:03 AM
Charles Freeborn   https://www.carburetion.com/   May 18 2024, 08:53 AM


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