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> Why did the 1.8 engines have L-jet?
VaccaRabite
post May 31 2024, 08:05 AM
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Has there ever been a reason Porsche/VW speced L-jet injection for the 1.8 engines instead of D-jet like the 1.7 and 2.0 engines used?

Usually when manufactures do this there are financial reasons for the change. Either they have the same engine on other vehicles they produce, or its just cheaper to use whatever part is being used.

But Porsche didn't use the T4 motor on other cars at the time. And if it was cheaper, they would have done away with Djet on the 1.7 and 2.0. I don't think VW was using l-let at the time for the bus... but maybe?

There has to be a reason that Porsche wanted Ljet on the 1.8.

Zach
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wonkipop
post Jun 2 2024, 04:34 PM
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@technicalninja

mr. b (Jeff Bowlsby) knows everything there is to know about D jet.
i've never owned a D jet i only know the history in a typically skim the surface way.
though digging out precise times and dates from obscure documents is something i have enjoyed regarding L jet. i've got an emotional stake in L jet and even 30 odd years ago when i got the car i knew it was significant for being the first car with the system.
(or so i thought until 3 or 4 years ago when i discovered it was actually the VW 412 - but if we say its the 1.8 air cooled engine in both cars then its true it was the first).

yes - basically D jet is an american home grown invention you might say.
D jet owes a tremendous amount to the schematic layout and elements of the Electrojet system.

I believe somewhere in the USA a person owns the only surviving intact specimen of this system. it was fitted to a certain low production chrysler model.

as to mercedes benz and their mechanical fuel injection systems.
as for instance applied to the gullwings, or stirling moss's famous racer.
straight from WW2. virtually the same system that went in the BF 109 fighter plane.
why....germany relied on artificial synthetic fuels made from coal processing.
very low octane. the engines needed mechanical fuel injection and superchargers to match the performance of british spitfires etc. the engines were also inverted in 109s so they could run the destructive 20mm cannon straight through the centre of the crankshaft. i think fuel injection was almost necessary to run the engine upside down so to speak. if you were in a 109 and you wanted to escape a spitfire you put it into a negative g at the top of the curve dive. the spitfire would stall trying to chase the 109.
until there was some kind of mrs shillings orifice or something like that to fix the problem of the carbies on the english engines.

but i digress. none of that stuff is electronic fuel injection. purely mechanical.

porsche were the same about injection. everything had to be for racing. at least during f. piechs time there during the 60s. so it was mechanical mechanical mechanical, even in the road cars.

i guess the point about L jet and its been made a million times is it was simple simple simple and cheap cheap cheap(er) than anything that had come before it.
still more expensive than a carby or two but.........if you are making a mass market car in huge numbers with a tiny engine that is going to be massively crippled by emissions laws you know its the only way you can go.
VW had its backs to the wall when it came to the USA market after the Nixon Clean Air Act of 1970. when bosch engineers rocked up with a fastback clandestinely fitted with a prototype system in the mid sixties, VW did not even hesitate. straight into it. lets go sort of thing. its a well known and often told story. about the merc sedan and the VW type 3 that were driven straight to the VW and Merc engineering departments with the keys tossed to them for a drive. birth of D jet.
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VaccaRabite   Why did the 1.8 engines have L-jet?   May 31 2024, 08:05 AM
930cabman   Bosch made them a deal they could not refuse :be...   May 31 2024, 08:29 AM
brant   Djet came out 1970 or earlier Ljet didn’t come ...   May 31 2024, 08:40 AM
Van B   It was the guinea pig for the FI system that was t...   May 31 2024, 08:44 AM
technicalninja   Progress... The 1.8 was born AFTER Bosch created ...   May 31 2024, 08:45 AM
JamesM   The D-Jet was rare enough that I have never had ...   May 31 2024, 03:18 PM
wonkipop   Progress... The 1.8 was born AFTER Bosch created...   May 31 2024, 04:48 PM
Maltese Falcon   Also known as the Bosch 'Barn Door efi. N/Den...   May 31 2024, 08:59 AM
Root_Werks   Thought I read someplace the 914-4 2.0's would...   May 31 2024, 10:03 AM
JeffBowlsby   D-Jet was not the first EFI, but it was the first ...   May 31 2024, 10:05 AM
dr914@autoatlanta.com   more modern, simpler and more emissions friendly ...   May 31 2024, 10:49 AM
wonkipop   more modern, simpler and more emissions friendly ...   May 31 2024, 04:02 PM
wonkipop   there is more to this too. there was a rival propo...   May 31 2024, 04:21 PM
wonkipop   there is another reason for L jet and it being nec...   May 31 2024, 06:47 PM
wonkipop   the member here who cracked all this open was @L-...   May 31 2024, 07:12 PM
L-Jet914   the member here who cracked all this open was @[...   May 31 2024, 08:24 PM
wonkipop   [quote name='wonkipop' post='3148575' date='May 3...   May 31 2024, 09:42 PM
L-Jet914   I can see why they left the vacuum hose on the adv...   Jun 1 2024, 08:03 PM
wonkipop   I can see why they left the vacuum hose on the ad...   Jun 1 2024, 08:51 PM
wonkipop   @technicalninja here you go for some "world...   Jun 1 2024, 09:30 PM
technicalninja   @wonkipop Thank you for all of your knowledge...   Jun 2 2024, 07:06 AM
JeffBowlsby   No ruffled feathers here...we are here in part to ...   Jun 2 2024, 07:58 AM
technicalninja   Druckfühlergesteuert... Now, there's a mouth...   Jun 2 2024, 08:14 AM
JeffBowlsby   Thanks! Then there was also Rochester Ramjet ...   Jun 2 2024, 08:21 AM
technicalninja   And here's the REALLY sad part... Just before...   Jun 2 2024, 08:32 AM
wonkipop   @technicalninja mr. b (Jeff Bowlsby) knows every...   Jun 2 2024, 04:34 PM
wonkipop   i might add @technicalninja there is very littl...   Jun 2 2024, 04:46 PM
wonkipop   @technicalninja - re first fuel injection made in...   Jun 2 2024, 05:00 PM
technicalninja   Two ways to measure load on an engine. Manifold va...   Jun 2 2024, 05:13 PM
wonkipop   Two ways to measure load on an engine. Manifold v...   Jun 2 2024, 05:43 PM
L-Jet914   [quote name='technicalninja' post='3148834' date=...   Jun 2 2024, 07:17 PM
wonkipop   @L-Jet914 yeah - in a similar vane (no pun intend...   Jun 3 2024, 12:47 AM
wonkipop   ps @technicalninja one of the cars that did hav...   Jun 2 2024, 05:58 PM
wonkipop   @technicalninja and anyone else vaguely interest...   Jun 3 2024, 04:31 AM
VaccaRabite   So L-jet was on VW buses and 412s starting in 1974...   Jun 3 2024, 06:53 AM
wonkipop   So L-jet was on VW buses and 412s starting in 197...   Jun 3 2024, 12:41 PM
mrholland2   So if this was the case: i suspect that no matte...   Jun 4 2024, 10:06 AM
wonkipop   So if this was the case: i suspect that no matt...   Jun 4 2024, 04:37 PM
wonkipop   So if this was the case: i suspect that no matt...   Jun 4 2024, 11:09 PM
L-Jet914   So if this was the case: i suspect that no mat...   Jun 6 2024, 01:06 AM
wonkipop   [quote name='mrholland2' post='3149086' date='Ju...   Jun 6 2024, 03:39 PM
L-Jet914   [quote name='wonkipop' post='3149230' date='Jun ...   Jun 6 2024, 06:25 PM
brant   your logic makes sense... but I would guess the st...   Jun 4 2024, 10:35 AM
JeffBowlsby   Djet is bank fire. 2 banks. For the 914, it’s ...   Jun 4 2024, 01:20 PM
wonkipop   Djet is bank fire. 2 banks. For the 914, it’s...   Jun 4 2024, 04:00 PM
technicalninja   All the L-jet I am familiar with is batch in the s...   Jun 4 2024, 01:38 PM
ClayPerrine   All the L-jet I am familiar with is batch in the ...   Jun 4 2024, 01:54 PM
brant   By now All the forms have changed likely Ha…. ...   Jun 4 2024, 08:52 PM
wonkipop   By now All the forms have changed likely Ha…. ...   Jun 4 2024, 09:50 PM
technicalninja   Here's the REAL kicker... High end aftermarke...   Jun 4 2024, 09:08 PM
JeffBowlsby   All things considered how is direct injection bene...   Jun 4 2024, 09:58 PM
wonkipop   All things considered how is direct injection ben...   Jun 4 2024, 10:04 PM
technicalninja   All things considered how is direct injection ben...   Jun 4 2024, 10:28 PM
technicalninja   Now, I wouldn't try to add it to an engine tha...   Jun 4 2024, 10:54 PM
wonkipop   here is another twist on it that happens when you ...   Jun 4 2024, 11:29 PM
technicalninja   One final note on DI reliability... A good friend...   Jun 4 2024, 11:30 PM
wonkipop   @L-Jet914 yeah thats the grey area then the depa...   Jun 6 2024, 10:01 PM
wonkipop   here is the emission specs on the two different 76...   Jun 6 2024, 10:58 PM
StarBear   CD capacitive discharge - could that be the ignito...   Jun 7 2024, 07:04 AM
technicalninja   Those are resistors, not capacitors. Capacitors a...   Jun 7 2024, 07:34 AM
wonkipop   Those are resistors, not capacitors. Capacitors ...   Jun 7 2024, 04:30 PM
technicalninja   The early use of CDI ignition was single strike (m...   Jun 7 2024, 09:46 AM


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