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> First start after 25 years - problems
spencercanon
post Dec 16 2024, 12:27 PM
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From: Bishop, California
Member No.: 28,482
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Hi all this is my first post here! I recently picked up a ’75 1.8 that was last registered in 2001! Pretty good barn find, in my opinion. It was up in the high desert of California, so no rust, great mechanicals, all the electrics work. Just flaking paint, decayed interior …and an engine that probably hasn’t run since the Clinton Administration.

The TLDR is the car has started and run for 10 seconds but now won’t start at all.

A quick timeline of what I’ve done/tested:
- Dropped the engine, adjusted valves (encountered something strange that I’ll ask about later)
- Old starter could barely turn the engine over. Replaced it with a hi-torque.
- good compression
- Replaced the old broken bellows thermostat
- New fuel lines, vac lines, spark plugs and wires
- deleted EGR system
- Fuel pump was getting power but dead - replaced it.
- Coil’s good. Cap and rotor look good. Points gapped.
- The L-Jet AFM had been opened and the adjustment wheel inside was so loose that it the flap wasn’t closing fully so the pump was running continuously. I rotated the wheel until there was enough tension to turn off the fuel pump. (I would have normally never touched the AFM!)

Put the engine back in and the car started on the key immediately, ran for 10 seconds and died. I tried again, it started and ran for 5 seconds, then popped loudly back up the intake with enough force to blow the intake boot off the AFM. Since then, it hasn’t started.

Couple notes:
- after the pop, I felt like the intake pipe connector hoses were probably leaking, so I put hose clamps on them. With those clamped down and fresh vac lines everywhere, I’m pretty sure there aren’t any more leaks.
- oil filler breather nipple broke so I’ve taped it off until I can get a new one. But I’m not sure how this affects the vacuum… should it be left open for now?
- I don’t know the fuel pressure but it does have a new pump and lines so I’d be surprised if pressure is the problem.
- tested injector ballasts and got correct ohm readings
- It did start and run on its own spark and fuel, so I assume ECU and injectors are OK.
- the AFM is obviously an issue … probably considerably off. But again, the car did at least start a few times.

So now what?
- I’d like to check/test anything I can before I start buying replacement components.
- Are there baseline settings for idle speed screw, and at least a “best guess” AFM setup?
- Should I just buy another AFM now, knowing this one may never be right again?
- could the intake backfire have damaged something?

Thanks in advance for your thoughts!


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technicalninja
post Dec 18 2024, 09:48 AM
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QUOTE(Artfrombama @ Dec 18 2024, 12:26 AM) *

QUOTE(technicalninja @ Dec 17 2024, 11:03 PM) *

QUOTE(Artfrombama @ Dec 17 2024, 10:12 PM) *

QUOTE(spencercanon @ Dec 16 2024, 06:45 PM) *


3) I physically verified #1 TDC and the distributor is 180 off. Is it that easy to install the distributor drive shaft backwards??

Please excuse me if I'm reading this wrong.....
But the piston is at TDC twice per power cycle, once on exhaust stroke and once on compression.
If the piston is on TDC exhaust stroke the rotor button will be 180* out.




If you put it in 180 out (this is 360 degrees crankshaft movement) and merely swap the wires two positions it will run just fine.



WHOOOOSH!
Right over his head


@artfrombama
Please let me know what I'm missing.

For the OP.

During top end tear down I'd be looking for evidence of exceptional VS evidence of ineptitude.
Springs or shims on rocker arm shafts. Shims are better.
Adjusters on rocker arms, single or two piece with elephants' foot (911 style). Two piece better
Pushrods- aluminum VS steel. steel is better
Gasket/fire ring between head and jug. Believe it or not, not having this part installed is better.
Another commonly upgraded part is the studs which hold the rocker arms in. Bigger is better here. The stock stuff will work fine but you have to be damn careful to not over torque these as they are prone to pulling the threads out of the head.

When head apart. Exhaust guide huge VS same size as intake. Same size better (at least more modern)
That big ass exhaust guide also means sodium filled exhaust valve.
You REALLY shouldn't machine sodium filled valves.
The world has moved AWAY from sodium filled valves.
It IS possible to have an explosion/fire machining sodium filled valves.

All of the core heads I've torn down now (3 pairs) have had completely trashed exhaust valve guides. Valves are "floppy" loose in the guides.

If you find a bunch of modern or improved parts, then it's possible that someone knowledgeable did the engine.

If someone merely installed hydraulic lifters where solids were supposed to go, then both the cam and lifters are TRASH!

Pulling a lifter will allow you to look into the lifter bore and view the cam lobe. The wear patterns on the lobes would "tell the tale" for me. Nice even wear with no flat spots or weird "ghosting" patterns on the lobes is what I'm looking for.
Normally if someone just swaps in new lifters on an old camshaft it TRASHES the lobes, and you can see the damage easily.

The face of the lifter can show damage as well.

Good Luck
Tell us what you find.
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Posts in this topic
spencercanon   First start after 25 years - problems   Dec 16 2024, 12:27 PM
930cabman   :wttc: Generally a 25 years nap is not a good th...   Dec 16 2024, 01:04 PM
Superhawk996   So now what? - I’d like to check/test anything ...   Dec 16 2024, 01:14 PM
porschetub   Hi all this is my first post here! I recently...   Dec 16 2024, 01:17 PM
Superhawk996   I’ll add one more thing (well maybe two or thre...   Dec 16 2024, 01:26 PM
spencercanon   The valve adjustment oddity was that the rocker ar...   Dec 16 2024, 01:39 PM
Superhawk996   The valve adjustment oddity was that the rocker a...   Dec 16 2024, 01:45 PM
fiacra   EDIT: I was writing this while you posted about t...   Dec 16 2024, 01:44 PM
technicalninja   I'd fire the critter on B12 carb spray next. I...   Dec 16 2024, 01:50 PM
Cairo94507   :wttc: What an excellent first post and introducti...   Dec 16 2024, 02:01 PM
technicalninja   The valve adjustment oddity was that the rocker ...   Dec 16 2024, 02:02 PM
technicalninja   Valve springs that have sat in a single position f...   Dec 16 2024, 02:06 PM
930cabman   What a great forum, 11 posts and the new guy has o...   Dec 16 2024, 02:06 PM
VaccaRabite   So, yeah. Everything Superhawk said - read it 2x....   Dec 16 2024, 02:30 PM
spencercanon   I'm digesting all the excellent advice from al...   Dec 16 2024, 02:43 PM
SirAndy   "Will it start", "Does it turn over...   Dec 16 2024, 02:52 PM
worn   "Will it start", "Does it turn ove...   Dec 16 2024, 10:39 PM
worn   "Will it start", "Does it turn ove...   Dec 20 2024, 08:42 PM
spencercanon   SirAndy's post is rhetorical I guess. But the ...   Dec 16 2024, 03:57 PM
spencercanon   I dropped the engine back out and pulled the intak...   Dec 16 2024, 04:29 PM
technicalninja   SirAndy's post is rhetorical I guess. But the...   Dec 16 2024, 05:24 PM
Jack Standz   Hey, good luck with the fix. Yeah, the valves are...   Dec 16 2024, 05:53 PM
technicalninja   :agree: :agree: You'll use that borescope t...   Dec 16 2024, 06:21 PM
spencercanon   Thanks again everyone for the responses. All my wr...   Dec 16 2024, 06:45 PM
Artfrombama   3) I physically verified #1 TDC and the distribu...   Dec 17 2024, 10:12 PM
technicalninja   If you pull the pushrod tubes (you need to change ...   Dec 16 2024, 06:55 PM
spencercanon   It would be just like me to get the cyl numbering ...   Dec 16 2024, 07:30 PM
ctc911ctc   Please say it was sarcasm, Hydraulic ? <_< ...   Dec 17 2024, 03:52 PM
Superhawk996   If you pull the pushrod tubes (you need to change...   Dec 17 2024, 09:34 AM
930cabman   If you pull the pushrod tubes (you need to chang...   Dec 17 2024, 11:03 AM
technicalninja   The L-jet FI system has a "cold start" i...   Dec 16 2024, 07:18 PM
technicalninja   You're good. Make sure the valves on cylinder#...   Dec 16 2024, 08:03 PM
spencercanon   I'd REALLY want to find out anything I could...   Dec 16 2024, 09:06 PM
Jack Standz   I'd REALLY want to find out anything I coul...   Dec 17 2024, 05:30 AM
technicalninja   I am not an engineer. I am a Technician! The ...   Dec 17 2024, 11:21 AM
technicalninja   If we're all wrong and your engine is fine, yo...   Dec 17 2024, 01:49 PM
Root_Werks   :popcorn: From some of the posts, almost sounds ...   Dec 17 2024, 03:11 PM
Jack Standz   Good point by TechnicalNinja about the distributor...   Dec 17 2024, 04:16 PM
emerygt350   But it ran....   Dec 17 2024, 05:52 PM
Superhawk996   But it ran.... Until it didn’t :evilgrin: Thi...   Dec 17 2024, 07:57 PM
technicalninja   3) I physically verified #1 TDC and the distrib...   Dec 17 2024, 11:03 PM
Artfrombama   [quote name='Artfrombama' post='3181951' date='De...   Dec 18 2024, 12:26 AM
VaccaRabite   [quote name='Artfrombama' post='3181951' date='D...   Dec 18 2024, 04:24 AM
ctc911ctc   [quote name='Artfrombama' post='3181959' date='De...   Dec 20 2024, 11:59 AM
Geezer914   I would consider replacing the valve springs and m...   Dec 18 2024, 08:57 AM
technicalninja   [quote name='Artfrombama' post='3181951' date='D...   Dec 18 2024, 09:48 AM
VaccaRabite   I meant to add this last night... There was a tim...   Dec 18 2024, 12:57 PM
930cabman   I meant to add this last night... There was a ti...   Dec 18 2024, 01:50 PM
technicalninja   TLDR: Sodium filled valves are not inherently bad ...   Dec 18 2024, 10:04 PM
barefoot   TLDR: Sodium filled valves are not inherently bad...   Dec 19 2024, 09:35 AM
technicalninja   Barefoot, I'm in agreement! :agree: Than...   Dec 19 2024, 10:49 AM
VaccaRabite   I was not aware you could even GET sodium filled v...   Dec 20 2024, 08:19 AM
flipb   Inconel was created for spaceflight. I've got ...   Dec 20 2024, 10:42 AM
technicalninja   Inconel was created for spaceflight. I've got...   Dec 20 2024, 01:14 PM
Spoke   About starting an engine after a long sleep, I bou...   Dec 20 2024, 09:02 PM
technicalninja   "Will it start", "Does it turn ov...   Dec 20 2024, 09:48 PM


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