 Buick/Rover aluminum v8 to 914 conversion |
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| streetrover |
 Dec 22 2009, 09:30 AM
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#1
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Member  Group: Members Posts: 87 Joined: 22-December 09 From: Inland Empire Member No.: 11,163 Region Association: Southern California  |
Hello everyone! OK, I've got an empty 914 in my driveway and a 4.0 liter Rover engine in my garage. A Buick 4bbl intake is en route as is an Edelbrock carb. I've got lots of questions about clearance, most notably about the distributor. The Rover engine came stock with a "crankshaft angle sensor" and individual coils. It'd be great to use this instead of the distributor but I don't know if I can run this ignition system without the "computer" that also controls the fuel injection. If I need to go with the distributor instead that's fine but then how do I overcome clearance restrictions? I would REALLY love to talk to someone with this conversion completed!!!
Thanks, Bob |
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| Mark Henry |
Dec 22 2009, 09:47 AM
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#2
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that's what I do! Group: Members Posts: 20,065 Joined: 27-December 02 From: Port Hope, Ontario Member No.: 26 Region Association: Canada |
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png)
I think some one else was doing or thinking about this, so try a search on this site. Also do a google search on megajolt jr. That would work. It's a DIY kit but can also be had pre-built from a few vendors. |
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| streetrover |
Dec 22 2009, 02:55 PM
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#3
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Member Group: Members Posts: 87 Joined: 22-December 09 From: Inland Empire Member No.: 11,163 Region Association: Southern California |
Thanks Mark! I scanned the Megajolt site and that seems like a good option. At around $200 it's comparable with the price of a timing cover swap and new distributor. I'll let you know how this goes.
Bob |
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| underthetire |
Dec 22 2009, 03:58 PM
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#4
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,062 Joined: 7-October 08 From: Brentwood Member No.: 9,623 Region Association: Northern California |
I use the Mega squirt II for everything. If the Mega Jolt is as tune able as the MS, you can really tweak the timing for a very smooth running engine !
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| Gint |
Dec 22 2009, 05:59 PM
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#5
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Mike Ginter Group: Admin Posts: 16,095 Joined: 26-December 02 From: Denver CO. Member No.: 20 Region Association: Rocky Mountains  |
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| Mark Henry |
Dec 22 2009, 06:44 PM
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#6
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that's what I do! Group: Members Posts: 20,065 Joined: 27-December 02 From: Port Hope, Ontario Member No.: 26 Region Association: Canada |
QUOTE(underthetire @ Dec 22 2009, 04:58 PM)  I use the Mega squirt II for everything. If the Mega Jolt is as tune able as the MS, you can really tweak the timing for a very smooth running engine ! Megajolt jr is the ignition only version of MS II, about half the price. You can also make MSII work ignition only and have the option for EFI in the future. |
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| andys |
Dec 22 2009, 07:15 PM
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#7
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,165 Joined: 21-May 03 From: Valencia, CA Member No.: 721 Region Association: None 
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Perhaps you could try to locate the correct computer for your application at a bone yard or perhaps from one of those on-line computer supply places. There may be some Rover forums that might give you some good advice as well; I recall there's a UK site that's very active. Anyway, if you have all the other components and there's a way to make it stand-alone, then I would think that's your best bet.
The Buick 215 swap has been done by someone here on this forum, so perhaps they'll chime in. IMO, this is a great swap that won't over-power the chassis. I rode in one some 30 years ago and was impressed with the balance of the car. Andys |
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| Cheapsnake |
Dec 22 2009, 07:43 PM
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 419 Joined: 15-November 07 From: Door County, WI Member No.: 8,341 |
Hey Bob, just sent you an email before I saw your post here. Yup, the dizzy is going to be the clearance issue with the firewall (don't even think about a belt driven water pump). The megajolt jr. setup seems like a very good option to get away from that problem. Right now, it looks like I can just clear the firewall by moving the engine back 3/4" - 1", referenced by the tranny mounts. I'll know in 2-3 weeks when I finally drop it in.
Beyond the dizzy issue, you're going to have to carve up the front engine shelf to clear the balancer and if your alternator is mounted high you're going to have a hit with the firewall. I ended up fabbing a down-low bracket. I think there's a way to make the stock engine mount bar work but I ended up fabbing my own simply because I didn't like the idea of welding on a casting. Jrust is also doing a Buick conversion so Jamie, if you're listening chime in. And yes, post some pics of your progress. Tom |
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| JRust |
Dec 22 2009, 08:00 PM
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#9
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 6,310 Joined: 10-January 03 From: Corvallis Oregon Member No.: 129 Region Association: Pacific Northwest
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Actually Tom to be more correct I am redoing my conversion. Mine was in & running. I just didn't like how the conversion was done overall. My tranny was in the stock location & the engine comes into my cab way to far. While working through some cooling issues because of the original setup. I went with Renegades radiator setup to solve that issue. Then I had my passenger side rear suspension ear break. So my engine is out while I replace the ear. While it is out I have quite a long list of things to redo.
1st- is moving my tranny back 1 1/2" with renegades tranny adapters. 2nd- is figuring out what I am changing on the front. I am planning on replacing my mechanical pump with a remote electric pump. Once that is done I will be replacing the pulley on my harmonic balancer for a much shorter single pulley. I'll have to relocate my current alternator bracket which sits behind the passenger seat. I am going to move it to the other side. 3rd- I have the Fuel Injection system off a 3.5 rover that is a direct bolt on. This may wait until later though. Just depends on how much I am chomping at the bit to get my car back on the road (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) If I can be of any help shoot me a line. Happy to take pics of anything for you. Although I know the 4.0 has some differences from my motor (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) |
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| streetrover |
Dec 23 2009, 01:54 AM
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#10
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Member Group: Members Posts: 87 Joined: 22-December 09 From: Inland Empire Member No.: 11,163 Region Association: Southern California |
OMG !!! Thanks to everyone! I've been a 914World member for fewer than 24 hours and already I'm reinvigorated and filled with new ideas! As I mentioned to Cheapsnake this project has seemed so overwhelming and I've felt completely alone until now. Tomorrow I'm going to try to post a few pix. In the meantime I've got a question. Is the Kennedy Engineering adapter plate and flywheel my best bet for this conversion? I need to know this soon as I want to bolt engine and trans together and stick them in the car to get a better feel for clearance than a measuring tape will allow.
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| GS Guy |
Dec 23 2009, 07:39 AM
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 243 Joined: 8-July 04 From: Columbia, MD Member No.: 2,325 Region Association: North East States |
Not sure how interchangeable the old Buick V6 components are with the later model Rover engine? But Buick did offer a FWD version of the 6 which had shorter water pump and possibly more flexible oil pump/filter location. This front cover was supposedly interchangeable with all Buick V6 engines.
The "ultimate" was the McLaren Indy V6 cover, with drives for oil and water pumps off to the side similar in layout to the Renegade V8 conversion components. Very short overall length with this big $$$ hardware! How about doing some custom modifications to the front cover? Plate up the water pump outlets so elbow fittings could be installed - then run remote water pump and alternator similar to the Renegade layout? Seems like that would make a nice set-up. I'd also talk to a couple of the US Rover/Buick/(Olds) performance outfits and see what can be done with bolt-on parts and making it as short as possible. http://www.thewedgeshop.com/ http://www.aluminumv8.com/ Jeff |
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| Cheapsnake |
Dec 23 2009, 08:22 AM
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#12
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Member Group: Members Posts: 419 Joined: 15-November 07 From: Door County, WI Member No.: 8,341 |
QUOTE(streetrover @ Dec 22 2009, 11:54 PM) OMG !!! Thanks to everyone! I've been a 914World member for fewer than 24 hours and already I'm reinvigorated and filled with new ideas! As I mentioned to Cheapsnake this project has seemed so overwhelming and I've felt completely alone until now. Tomorrow I'm going to try to post a few pix. In the meantime I've got a question. Is the Kennedy Engineering adapter plate and flywheel my best bet for this conversion? I need to know this soon as I want to bolt engine and trans together and stick them in the car to get a better feel for clearance than a measuring tape will allow. Yup, Kennedy is your best bet and your only bet since Renegade no longer does the Rover. They'll get you everything you need and are great to work with. I've got dimensions off my engine/tranny setup that I'll email you. They'll help you get a vague idea of the placement required to clear the firewall. In the end, I think you'll find, as Jamie and I did, that a 1" -1 1/2" move back is going to be required. You could possibly just squeeze it in with a relocation of the brake proportioning valve and throttle cable and severe cutting of the front shelf, but then access for maintenance would be iffy. The move back is not such a bad thing, the CV joints are OK with it, you'll just have to cobble up some new tranny mounts. Let me qualify my condemnation of a belt-driven water pump. I was talking about the stock engine mounted pump and pulley and extended crank pulley which would require a whole lot of moving back to clear the firewall. Actually a remote belt-driven pump is a very viable option as long as you can use the balancer's single pulley to drive the water pump and the alternator. I simply cut the pulley and impeller out of my stock pump and am using the housing as a plenum for a remote pump. Jeff's idea of fabbing up elbows for the water inlets is also a possibility and might gain you a slight amount of clearance. I went with an electric pump just for the sake of simplicity but I'm still not sure that was the best choice over belt-driven. We'll see this summer. Looking forward to your pics and I hope to have some ready to post in the next couple of days. Tom |
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| JRust |
Dec 23 2009, 08:13 PM
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#14
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 6,310 Joined: 10-January 03 From: Corvallis Oregon Member No.: 129 Region Association: Pacific Northwest
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I like it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif) . The more that do this conversion. The more dialed in we will get on what works best. Take pics of everything as you go. It's a huge help later in figuring out why you did it this way or that way. Love to see that bad boy come together (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
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| GS Guy |
Dec 23 2009, 08:27 PM
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#15
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Member Group: Members Posts: 243 Joined: 8-July 04 From: Columbia, MD Member No.: 2,325 Region Association: North East States |
What's the rated HP & Torque of the 4.0? What are the hot-rodding plans? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif)
That factory intake has the most beautiful set if individual runner intake stacks under the big plenum chamber on top!!! If one could just figure out how to add butterflies in each runner - and keep them exposed, you'd have one Bad-Boy intake system to show off! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif) It looks like you already have a pretty short front cover and pullies on that engine version, maybe it won't need much shortening! A 4L V8 seems like the ideal match with the overall car performance and weight, and especially with the transaxle capacity. Jeff |
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| codices |
Dec 24 2009, 12:54 AM
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#16
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Member Group: Members Posts: 95 Joined: 9-October 08 From: Morrison, Colorado Member No.: 9,626 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
I'm in the process with a Buick bored out.030 over with ARP studs throughout and lots of Crane equipment. I have a cradle for the engine/transaxle from Red Dawg along with the Kennedy adapter and clutch. Keep us posted and I will take pictures as I make progress ------after this cold and snow departs Colorado and I can then have my warm garage back.
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| Cheapsnake |
Dec 24 2009, 06:33 AM
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#17
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Member Group: Members Posts: 419 Joined: 15-November 07 From: Door County, WI Member No.: 8,341 |
Let the fun begin! I hope that fine paint job survives the cutting \, grinding and weldong to come.
Got any plans to dig into the engine? I would check into the the cradle from Red Dawg that codices mentioned. I would have if I had known about it and saved a whole bunch of time fabbing my own. Have a Merry Christmas! Tom |
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| streetrover |
Dec 24 2009, 10:04 AM
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#18
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Member Group: Members Posts: 87 Joined: 22-December 09 From: Inland Empire Member No.: 11,163 Region Association: Southern California |
THREE WEEK BACKLOG and Kennedy Engineering! Damn, wish I'd known about this earlier. My plans to practice the transplant a few times to check clearances is now on hold. Damn, Damn, DAMN!
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| streetrover |
Dec 24 2009, 12:50 PM
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#19
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Member Group: Members Posts: 87 Joined: 22-December 09 From: Inland Empire Member No.: 11,163 Region Association: Southern California |
Exhaust manifolds...
Hi JRust, while I was on the BuickV8 forum I noticed you had some cast iron exhaust manifolds for the Buick 215/Rover 4.0 engine. Are they still available? Thanx, Bob |
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| streetrover |
Dec 24 2009, 12:59 PM
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#20
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Member Group: Members Posts: 87 Joined: 22-December 09 From: Inland Empire Member No.: 11,163 Region Association: Southern California |
No real hot-rodding plans for motor. I want to see if the stock approx. 200hp is enough to keep me hard. More worried about shoehorning engine/trans into available space. I DO NOT WANT TO CUT INTO FIREWALL !!! Only cutting renegade small block chevy makes in for rear distributor - with Megajolt EDIS I can eliminate distributor entirely and hopefully have NO CUTTING INTO FIREWALL.
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