 Crashed 914 in Malaysia - Opinions please |
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| johannes |
 Jan 1 2010, 05:04 PM
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#41
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Club Porsche 914 France President  Group: Members Posts: 3,084 Joined: 13-January 06 From: France Member No.: 5,409 Region Association: France  |
QUOTE(jimtab @ Jan 1 2010, 02:51 PM)  QUOTE(johannes @ Jan 1 2010, 01:01 PM) Me says there is some engeneering issue with that security device. My understanding is that the guard rail is set far too high for a 914. The front of the car slipped under the guard rail and the car hit at least two poles. This is a total failure of the security equipement. (I believe the guard rail NOT to be in that design and TO BE shoved into the weird bow due to impact) I DO NOT believe it to be a sign post or some sort of turn warning. The TWO poles seen on the picture are the same as seen behind the car supporting the guard rail. Isn't that just what that type of barrier is supposed to do? I was pretty sure that they are sacrificial in order to dissipate the energy, ARMCO was a great invention that has probably saved as many lives as seatbelts, IMHO. The poles aren't supposed to be that "agressive" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_UKFr6_uQk |
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| FourBlades |
Jan 1 2010, 05:31 PM
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#42
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From Wreck to Rockin Group: Members Posts: 2,056 Joined: 3-December 07 From: Brevard, FL Member No.: 8,414 Region Association: South East States 
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The owner should invest some money in driver educations and maybe a rollcage if he is going to keep driving like that. If you ship in a shell, I bet there will be three driving 914s in Malaysia in the not too distant future. John |
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| 6freak |
Jan 1 2010, 10:03 PM
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#43
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MR.C Group: Members Posts: 4,740 Joined: 19-March 08 From: Tacoma WA Member No.: 8,829 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
QUOTE(johannes @ Jan 1 2010, 01:01 PM) Me says there is some engeneering issue with that security device. My understanding is that the guard rail is set far too high for a 914. The front of the car slipped under the guard rail and the car hit at least two poles. This is a total failure of the security equipement. (I believe the guard rail NOT to be in that design and TO BE shoved into the weird bow due to impact) I DO NOT believe it to be a sign post or some sort of turn warning. The TWO poles seen on the picture are the same as seen behind the car supporting the guard rail. the part next to the rear wheel is the front bumper ....truth is only the driver can tell the real story ..the rest is a guess ,some educated some not |
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| JoeSharp |
Jan 2 2010, 07:01 AM
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#44
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In Irvine, Ca. May 15-18 Group: Members Posts: 3,947 Joined: 9-July 03 From: DeLand, Florida Member No.: 898 Region Association: South East States |
QUOTE(FourBlades @ Jan 1 2010, 03:31 PM) The owner should invest some money in driver educations and maybe a rollcage if he is going to keep driving like that. If you ship in a shell, I bet there will be three driving 914s in Malaysia in the not too distant future. John Sorry John, but I know Meng perty well. He loves his 914 and has been putting parts and money into it for a long time. Meng and his wife Fey have been here and Meng has been to several NARP Bar-B-Q's. I think that the only thing that we can do for Meng is send him a tub. I like the idea of just putting one in a container and sending it. Meng hangs with some high powered friends and I'm sure they can work out all of the problems at the other end. |
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| jim_hoyland |
Jan 2 2010, 09:09 AM
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#45
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Get that VIN ? Group: Members Posts: 9,561 Joined: 1-May 03 From: Sunset Beach, CA Member No.: 643 Region Association: Southern California
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QUOTE Sorry John, but I know Meng perty well. He loves his 914 and has been putting parts and money into it for a long time. Meng and his wife Fey have been here and Meng has been to several NARP Bar-B-Q's. I think that the only thing that we can do for Meng is send him a tub. I like the idea of just putting one in a container and sending it. Meng hangs with some high powered friends and I'm sure they can work out all of the problems at the other end. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) |
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| Lou W |
Jan 2 2010, 11:20 AM
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#46
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"Here Kitty Kitty" my ass...... Group: Members Posts: 4,109 Joined: 9-May 04 From: Roseburg, OR. Member No.: 2,039 Region Association: Spain |
QUOTE(jim_hoyland @ Jan 2 2010, 09:09 AM) QUOTE Sorry John, but I know Meng perty well. He loves his 914 and has been putting parts and money into it for a long time. Meng and his wife Fey have been here and Meng has been to several NARP Bar-B-Q's. I think that the only thing that we can do for Meng is send him a tub. I like the idea of just putting one in a container and sending it. Meng hangs with some high powered friends and I'm sure they can work out all of the problems at the other end. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) I remember him from the BBQ's, I think thats a great idea (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) |
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| Mr.242 |
Jan 2 2010, 02:03 PM
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#47
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May your glass be smaller so it's always FULL! Group: Members Posts: 1,079 Joined: 10-June 08 From: Seattle Member No.: 9,160 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
QUOTE Sorry John, but I know Meng perty well. He loves his 914 and has been putting parts and money into it for a long time. Meng and his wife Fey have been here and Meng has been to several NARP Bar-B-Q's. I think that the only thing that we can do for Meng is send him a tub. I like the idea of just putting one in a container and sending it. Meng hangs with some high powered friends and I'm sure they can work out all of the problems at the other end. SOOOO....2 questions if you know him well. 1) Can you tell us if he removed the proportioning valve? 2) Can you get a GOOGLE earth picture of the area he wrecked? I know two people who love their cars very much too, but neither one of them has stuffed it into an innocent guard rail! YET. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) It wasn't the road's fault, the guard rail's fault, the tire's fault........uuummmmmm, driver decision put that thing on the tow truck. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif) |
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| TC 914-8 |
Jan 2 2010, 09:26 PM
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#48
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 817 Joined: 23-May 08 From: Sequim, WA Member No.: 9,090 Region Association: Pacific Northwest
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QUOTE(messix @ Jan 1 2010, 12:37 AM) QUOTE(Elliot Cannon @ Jan 1 2010, 01:27 AM) QUOTE(Mr.242 @ Dec 31 2009, 12:24 PM) Fixable. my .02 worth. Here is my "crash investigation" with the limited picture I have. The RED lines indicate that car had rotated and the rear/front crossed. The LIME green indicate 'possible' contact damage with the guard rail (I believe the guard rail to be in that design and NOT shoved into the weird bow due to impact) The BLACK represent what I believe to have caused the damage to the car or what contacted. With more pictures I could tell you what it hit. But I believe it to be a sign post or some sort of turn warning. There are TWO posts in the picture. Look by the left rear tire. The post definitely hit the long or something low such as that post or it's concrete base. The post fell and struck the windscreen and passenger ooops, driver door. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif) Right handed drive car... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) LEFT DOOR obviously was struck. I would bet the post with the sign (by left rear tire) struck the upper part of the door and the windscreen/support. THE PINK BOX. Here lies the WTF? question. How did this guy lose it BEFORE the turn. The red lines and dirt spray indicate the direction he is traveling. The driver lost this BEFORE getting to the APEX of the turn. So something happened such as getting a tire into the dirt or............................ A LOCK TIRE ALWAYS LEADS. This is why removing the proportioning valve is a BAD thing. When you pull the Parking Brake on a car is spins right? Well, the laws of physics cause that. A locked tire will always come around and lead! ALWAYS. I would bet the right side of the tires have scrub on the sidewalls. The vehicle rotated clockwise. So the driver had some sort of input....... MY CONCLUSION: The driver was driving hard and fast. He comes down a straight with heavy right foot. He does his braking BEFORE the turn as required. But his heavy right foot touches the brakes too hard and with the removal of the proportioning valve the rear tires lock. The vehicle rotates and then the driver is just along for the CIRCUS RIDE. A 914 spins so quick anyway. I bet the driver's seat cushion is needing replaced! Bet the driver SUCKED IT UP HIS ASS just off this camera view! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) Does anyone know where this happened and can get a GOOGLE earth view of the scene. It will tell me more or us more for sure. Be careful people, these cars only go where you put them. It's a shame and I'm glad all the people are fine. Except the driver who is removing leather from up his ASS! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif) What a genius! You figured that all out from 10,000 miles away? Are you a CSI? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif) nope he's just a washington state patrolman I wonder where Mr.242 has been hiding? Great analysis ! Pass the word to the other WSP fellas to go easy on the 914 guys (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif) This whole thread is a shame, its nice to see everyone coming together to help, or at least figure out a way to keep his car alive. |
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| bdstone914 |
Jan 3 2010, 12:40 AM
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#49
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bdstone914 Group: Members Posts: 4,735 Joined: 8-November 03 From: Riverside CA Member No.: 1,319 |
Thanks to all for your constructive replies.
I am working with Meng to determine the best way to get him a very clean 1970 roller that I have. I do not think it is right for any of us to judge his driving ability or the cause of the accident. I started this thread to get knowable opinions on if that car should/could be fixed or start with a new car. Bruce |
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| EdwardBlume |
Jan 3 2010, 08:26 AM
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#50
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914 Wizard Group: Members Posts: 12,338 Joined: 2-January 03 From: SLO Member No.: 81 Region Association: Central California
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(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) If its any consolation, I'm a crappy driver, especially when a Brittney Spears song comes on the radio... Plenty of 914s, 911s, and Boxsters end up tweeked after 'spirited' driving... doesn't make it any less tragic, but it happens.... |
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| JoeSharp |
Jan 3 2010, 03:09 PM
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#51
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In Irvine, Ca. May 15-18 Group: Members Posts: 3,947 Joined: 9-July 03 From: DeLand, Florida Member No.: 898 Region Association: South East States |
Thanks Bruce, let me know if I can help.
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| Mr.242 |
Jan 4 2010, 10:53 AM
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#52
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May your glass be smaller so it's always FULL! Group: Members Posts: 1,079 Joined: 10-June 08 From: Seattle Member No.: 9,160 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
Did we check on the seat cushion? Is it needed?
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) I jest in the humor because he has the option to rebuild and to learn from the mistake. Yes a mistake........it's all good. He should smile, it could be his girlfriend, wife, or whomever who got pregnant......then it's payments for a very long time! WRECKING is cool.....he had that thing right to the edge but just went a touch too far. VERY FEWpeople have ever done that. I meant NO attack on his driving; none. Just my job coming thru to ask questions about the collision. I'm always looking. I then typed my thoughts.... In my line of work we have TWO classifications of people: 1)Those who have wrecked. 2) Those who have YET to wreck. Everyone makes it into one of these categories in their career of driving! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif) Here's to seeing the thing back on the road! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) Mark p.s. My kids don't have a chance when they put the family truckster into the ditch and claim "I wasn't going that fast!" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif) |
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| maf914 |
Jan 4 2010, 03:30 PM
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#53
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Not a Guru! Group: Members Posts: 3,049 Joined: 30-April 03 From: Central Florida Member No.: 632 Region Association: None
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QUOTE(johannes @ Jan 1 2010, 03:04 PM) QUOTE(jimtab @ Jan 1 2010, 02:51 PM) QUOTE(johannes @ Jan 1 2010, 01:01 PM) Me says there is some engeneering issue with that security device. My understanding is that the guard rail is set far too high for a 914. The front of the car slipped under the guard rail and the car hit at least two poles. This is a total failure of the security equipement. (I believe the guard rail NOT to be in that design and TO BE shoved into the weird bow due to impact) I DO NOT believe it to be a sign post or some sort of turn warning. The TWO poles seen on the picture are the same as seen behind the car supporting the guard rail. Isn't that just what that type of barrier is supposed to do? I was pretty sure that they are sacrificial in order to dissipate the energy, ARMCO was a great invention that has probably saved as many lives as seatbelts, IMHO. The poles aren't supposed to be that "agressive" This discussion reminds me of the fatal accident in which Francois Cevert was killed when his F1 Tyrell Ford submarined the armco at Watkins Glen in the 70's. There is no question armco type barriers work when the accident is within the performance parameters of the barriers and the vehicle is contained, but get underneath the barriers and all bets are off. If you look at most new or renovated racing circuits, armco use is much more limited than in the past, having been replaced with concrete barriers, SAFER barriers, and tire walls. |
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| SirAndy |
Jan 4 2010, 05:06 PM
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#54
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Resident German Group: Admin Posts: 41,945 Joined: 21-January 03 From: Oakland, Kalifornia Member No.: 179 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(Mr.242 @ Jan 2 2010, 12:03 PM) 1) Can you tell us if he removed the proportioning valve? Does that mean i'm going to die? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) |
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| Kirmizi |
Jan 4 2010, 05:12 PM
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#55
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 836 Joined: 12-February 06 From: Wyoming, US Member No.: 5,568 Region Association: None |
Andy... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif)
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| markb |
Jan 4 2010, 08:01 PM
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#56
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914less :( Group: Members Posts: 5,449 Joined: 22-January 03 From: Nipomo, CA Member No.: 180 Region Association: Central California
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QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jan 4 2010, 03:06 PM) QUOTE(Mr.242 @ Jan 2 2010, 12:03 PM) 1) Can you tell us if he removed the proportioning valve? Does that mean i'm going to die? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) Eventually....happens to the best (or should I say all) of us. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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| jimtab |
Jan 4 2010, 10:10 PM
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#57
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,477 Joined: 5-January 03 From: Pacifica, California Member No.: 91 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jan 4 2010, 03:06 PM) QUOTE(Mr.242 @ Jan 2 2010, 12:03 PM) 1) Can you tell us if he removed the proportioning valve? Does that mean i'm going to die? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) Yes, ANdy, like everyone else, you are going to die.....sorry. |
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| JoeSharp |
Jan 5 2010, 09:29 AM
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#58
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In Irvine, Ca. May 15-18 Group: Members Posts: 3,947 Joined: 9-July 03 From: DeLand, Florida Member No.: 898 Region Association: South East States |
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| SirAndy |
Jan 5 2010, 11:56 AM
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#59
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Resident German Group: Admin Posts: 41,945 Joined: 21-January 03 From: Oakland, Kalifornia Member No.: 179 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(bdstone914 @ Jan 2 2010, 10:40 PM) I am working with Meng to determine the best way to get him a very clean 1970 roller that I have. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_pokal.gif) |
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| Rotary'14 |
Jan 5 2010, 04:51 PM
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#60
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 753 Joined: 24-April 05 From: Los Angeles Member No.: 3,977 |
Just seeing these pics make me want to cry (really) I killed one,, (some might say it needed killing), and now Meng's is on life support.
I say send Meng a shell,, I can only send him a clean driver door and probably a good windshield frame and a decent hood. -Rob |
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