The 914 5-Lug 911 Suspension Question and Answer Thread, All you wanted to know in one place... Options

[jaxdream]

Fantastic write up not withstanding , just a note on the strut inserts , the 911 inserts are valved different than the 914 inserts- different rebound rate and compression . If the 911 inserts would work ok , then I will keep the Bilsteins I have - inserts and all , and just bolt them on , but from all that has been posted on the forums about the differences between the 911 inserts and the 914 inserts , I won't be using them.
Mark henry , Eric is right about the tranny flanges you are trying to use , I got a pair of 911 108's to do a swap onto my 914 side shift and there was no problem in the mounting of the 108 flanges. I did however switch to the 911 100mm flange to make use of the 944 cv setup , and again the 911 100 flanges slid right in no problem at all with the flange shaft length . You may have to hunt some more on the getting of the 108 tranny flanges . Heck before I found the forum I had got a pair of so called 911 6 bolt flanges off of evilbay , only to find out that they were the real early 6 bolt small circle flange IIRC about 93mm size - no real use to me or anyone else except some body restoring an early 911 that used this size of flange , heck I don't know of what cv would use with these . anywho , you may need to look some more, good luck.

Jack / Jaxdream

[Eric_Shea]

Could you please just measure the length of the input shaft to the shoulder?

...How much longer is the sway-a-way axle over stock?
Of course you know I now have to see if this flange will work with stock axels.
davep also has a set of these flanges.

I think the main issue would be the seal and how it interfaces and the axle length.

Sway-a-Ways can be ordered in many lengths however, the 914 axle is 28mm longer than the 911 axle.

I'll see if I can yank these over the weekend and get a measurement for you. It's a buttload of work (that 17mm bolt) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Eric_Shea]

Regarding valving on inserts. I had a long conversation with an Engineer at Koni who stated the valving is only different slightly on the high speed rebound (he looked up the values while we were on the phone). An early 911 front end and a 914 front end are only a few pounds off from each other in the grand scheme of things. He stated the valving could be changed (for my Koni 911 strut inserts) but I probably wouldn't notice it at all.

Not sure what Bilstein would have to say. I would simply bolt them on if it were my car. If I recall, the 40 lbs. difference isn't worth the worry.

[Mark Henry]

Quit looking I found one. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
I also remember something the Dr. was thinking with the 912 diff, but that would have to be confimed.

I'll have to measure them proper, but they "ballpark" measure .150 longer overall.
They still sit on the seal OK.

[jaxdream]

Thanks , Eric , that's a great thing , just wasn't that sure considering all the debate over the valving difference between the 911 and 914 . Shoot I'll just run them and if I don't like em I'll just switch to the 911 spindle 914 strut hybrid I made up, used a 89 911 spindle pressed onto a 73 914 strut tube to use the Boge 914 inserts I have .
Thanks again , like I said in my earlier post , Mark has an as you put it rare tranny stub shaft setup.I have went through the same thing checking the differences between the 911 108's and the 914 tranny stubs .

Jack / Jaxdream

[shoguneagle]

On the front, I did the "Sir Andy Way" after changing over to Koni's and new sway bar, torsion bars, etc. The back I first did the five lug mod to 914 hubs but am now doing the 911 hub, sway-a-way axles, and larger CV joints.

Excellent writeup and follow comments are very appropriate.

Sway-A-Axle set I believe to 20.25 inches long. Will look up the part number and see if it is available. We also need the 911 CV joint part number, size, etc. that is available. I believe the 100mm CV joint is still available.

Anyway, excellent information.

Steve Hurt

[Mark Henry]

Thanks Jack.

The only real issue I'll have is the smaller 914 flanges will need to be cut on a lathe a bit to fit the diff on the 911 into bug conversion .

[veltror]

Stunning Eric, but it has given me a whole bunch of new ideas and headaches...

[lancelotIV]

Thanks Eric! This is so informative!! Appreciate all your guidance!

[JFJ914]

Eric,

One question I have that you did not address directly, will 914 calibrated Koni, Bilstein inserts for Boge struts fit in 911 SC, Carrera Boge struts or do I have to use the 911 calibrated ones?

[strawman]

Great write-up Eric! I also second the notion that Eric is a great resource and vendor.

Can you expand on how the 108mm 930 CVs need to be modified? Or will it be obvious once I get to that step in my project...

[76er]

Most excellent write up. You sure saved me a lot of thread surfing and confusion.
Thanks again. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Eric_Shea]

John, I'm not sure about that one but I believe they do. It has been discussed here but, I forgot the thread and the answer to be honest.

930 CV's - Good question. Because the 70's 911 108mm CV's are NLA, you can sub it with the same size 930 CV. It's the exact same issue we have with 914 CV's and Type 1 CV's. The 911 and the 914 are 4-bolt 2-pin systems and the 930 and the Type 1 CV's are 6-bolt systems. The 930 CV, stub axle and flanges can be modified for a pin or, the stub axles and flanges can be machined for a pair of M10x1.5 fasteners.

Thanks Guys. Happy to help. I've been thinking about this one for a few years it seems.

[venice914]

Eric, thank you for this. Perfect timing for me as I'm about to finally start working on my teener that's been sitting in the driveway for the last 4 years and a 5 lug set up is in the plans.

[Zardozz]

/whoosh.

Most of that went right over my head BUT I think I now know what I'm going to do.

[charliew]

Very thorough write up Eric. Thanks for getting it all in one thread. I posted somewhere about some Bilsteins that the part number crosses to both the 914 and the 911, The part number is: F4-P36-0113 HO, also the bilstein gland nut number for the boge strut to hold the bilstein insert,(911T strut) is: B4-B36-U242E2 I got this from Victor at bilstein 1-858-836-5900

Also my preference on the emergency brake shoe expander/cable solution is the later angle pull 944 hardware. I will also use the 944 cables and a center eb handle probably but lately I have been thinking about the eb pedal in the wifes camry. You press it to set it and press it again to release it. I know theres not much room in the pedal area but we will see.

[chuckc]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_pokal.gif)

But what about Option #4 ???


Some of us lazy guys, like me, just went and unbolted a complete 911 front end out of the 911 and bolted it right into their 914.

I found a wrecked '84 carrera with a good front end.
I unbolted the crossmember and steering rack, the A-Arms in the front and the shocks at the towers.
Then i rolled the whole package over to my 914 and bolted it back up.

Sometimes, lazy is gud!
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) Andy


(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-8-1148754291.jpg)

This is an all together Fantastic thread!! What is the year range for the 911 front ends that can be swapped?
peace,
Chuck

[PRS914-6]

Great write-up Eric. I would add 2 things.....

All things being equal, the "hub centric" flanges are more desireable. They allow wheels to center off the hub instead of the lug nuts.

When I built my car with the 108mm 911 tranny flanges I ran into a set where the shaft area that fit into the diff was about .020 smaller. I doubt if anyone would even notice. It would have been catastrophic if used. I have played tag with too many trees and can't remember the exact details other than they looked perfect but were a different size. The point to remember is to slide the flanges in the diff (without seals installed) and make sure there is no movement. It was California Motorsports that got me the correct diameter flanges. Sorry I can't remember more details

[Randal]

Great write up Eric. And it is nice to have it all in one place!

Well Done.

[krazykonrad]

Can we nail this to the top of the list with the other classic threads? I probably used all the wrong interweb bulletin board terms, but it would be great to keep thi one easy to find.

Thanks Eric!

Konrad