OT: Shop Repair Question, What would you do? Options

[pbanders]

I took my BMW E36 M3 to my local shop for a "Check Engine" light. They read the code out, charcoal cannister diverter valve. They pull the valve, replace it, and about 10 miles later, "check engine" is back on. They take the car in, and now they find a reference that tells them that an internal valve in the charcoal cannister can cause this problem. They replace the cannister - I just got it back, time will tell if it's really fixed.

Question - since the diverter valve ($160 for replacement) wasn't the problem, and I doubt it was bad (mechanic told me it can't be tested out of the car - while the shop foreman said "oh, we tested it and it was bad"), should I be billed for it? Seems like to me that if it didn't fix the problem, and it wasn't bad, I shouldn't pay for it, right? The cannister cost me another $200 on top of the $160, proving again to me that no BMW repair, no matter what it is, costs at least a few hundred dollars.

It's a moot point, I know - the diverter valve is long gone. But I was wondering what the list wisdom is about these kind of repairs where you get charged for part after part until it finally is fixed.

[TimT]

Used to be you could ask the mech to see your old parts... that doesnt do you much good when the "parts swappers" are changing relays. small valves etc....

Cars dont get to the dealers with catastophic failures much anymore... because these failures dont happen often..

The code reader in the BMW Porsche etc.. gives a daisy chain of things to look for....maybe sometimes you wont know if the systems are all ok till you operate the car for awhile..

And BMW repairs will not be cheap...the physical engine is bullet proof.. its all the sensors, and systems that are prone to failure...

[davep]

I think it is good practice to request the mech to save all replaced parts. Keep them until you are sure the repair was successful. There are few mechs these days that can properly diagnose a problem. Some will just swap parts till you get a new car, and charge you for the privilege. If you don't protest, they haven't hurt you enough and they'll push the limit further.

[TimT]

I think it is good practice to request the mech to save all replaced parts

Dave I totally agree... my point was that if dealers are just changing relays or odd valves here and there.. or DME sensors.....nothing can prevent them from pulling a DME sensor from behind the counter and telling you its yours...

[airsix]

I would tell them that since it was a faulty diagnosis you want the old part put back or the new one for free. My dad just went through this with his 300zx. Speedo sensor on the tranny went bad. He took it in and told them the speedo sensor on the tranny was bad (He has his own Nissan shop manuals and did his own diagnostic). They said "No we think it's the speedometer". So a week later they've trashed the dash and replaced the speedometer only to say "It'll be a few more days because it turns out its the speed sensor on the tranny". He said "Just like I told you in the first place. So you going to put the old speedometer back in or do I keep this one for free?" They were not happy. But like John Wayne said, life is tough. It's even tougher when you're stupid.

-Ben M.

[ChrisFoley]

It probably pays to be a big asshole when dealing with service departments that do this shit. You know they're making money or they would go out of biz instead. It won't hurt them much to give back a little now and then.
I used to recommend that my wife have her Accord serviced at the local Honda dealership because they had a great reputation, and she put a lot of mileage on the car. After 3 flat tires due to cracked valve stems on 3 occasions within a month of tire changes we got the picture. We were told they don't replace the valve stems in order to save the customer a few bucks. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)
I guess they don't bother inspecting them either. They just don't give a shit, and we will probably never buy another Honda as a result. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ar15.gif)

[airsix]

I guess they don't bother inspecting them either.  They just don't give a shit, and we will probably never buy another Honda as a result.  :shoot2kill:

Not trying to be a weenie or anything, but you admit that Honda makes a good car and yet you're going to avoid them now because one mechanic in one dealership didn't replace your valve stem? Seems a little excessive. The dropout fixing the tire didn't have anything to do with the design or construction of the car. Enough feedback from customers like you and maybe that particular service dept. will shape up.
-Ben M.

[ChrisFoley]

Not trying to be a weenie or anything, but you admit that Honda makes a good car and yet you're going to avoid them now because one mechanic in one dealership didn't replace your valve stem? Seems a little excessive.

Three wheels on three separate occasions. And that's just the tip of the iceberg, don't get me started!
There isn't another Honda dealer locally where we could switch to for better service.
Wife's car, wife's decision. She wants a hybrid next. The choice is between the Insight/Civic and the Prius, and there's a Toyota dealership nearby that also has a great reputation. Easy decision.

[ChrisFoley]

Seems a little excessive.

Valve stems are a safety issue, and should be replaced when new tires are installed, Period!
If they can't do that right then what else are they f'ing up. Like I said, don't get me started! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)

[TimT]

Valve stems are a safety issue, and should be replaced when new tires are installed, Period!

YES!!!! I dont know where this practice started.. reusing valve stems.... they are rubber and the same age as the tire usually... they are subject to centripidal force (Porsche made little stand up thingies for 911 wheel valve stems)

Used to be you would go for new tires... the first thing the guy would do is pull out the valve stem!!! just grab it with one of those "special tire mounting pliers things" and rip it right out!!

Then take the old tire off... install new valve stem etc...

cheap mother fuckers... and this IS a safety issue...

hehe chris didnt get started I did LOL