 Infineon AX, 914 TTOD as usual |
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| ppickerell |
 Nov 15 2004, 11:05 AM
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#61
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914 addicted  Group: Members Posts: 1,679 Joined: 14-October 03 From: Pleasanton, CA. Member No.: 1,246  |
Mark,
Were you running yesterday? I met a bunch of new (to me) members yesterday as well as some business acquaintances that I did not now were porscheaphiles. I talked to people from GGR LPR, SVR and Redwood region. Man we are lucky here in the bay area! |
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| ppickerell |
Nov 15 2004, 11:11 AM
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#62
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914 addicted Group: Members Posts: 1,679 Joined: 14-October 03 From: Pleasanton, CA. Member No.: 1,246 |
Mark, You would have to post my cone carnage. I killed seven little conical fellers during timed runs (f'in taildragger!), and many more went to their graves during the warmup laps. Warm up lap cones did not count so I took cones out with abandon to give the course workers something to complain about. Oh shit, here comes the yellow car again!
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| J P Stein |
Nov 15 2004, 11:26 AM
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#63
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Irrelevant old fart Group: Members Posts: 8,797 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Vancouver, WA Member No.: 45 Region Association: None |
Good grief, lines and cones.
I suppose all the clubs do things a bit differently with their layouts. We have all the changes of direction, but we don't constrict lines that that.....more optional approaches/exits and prolly 1/2 the cones.....no lines except in sections where it can get confusing and that doesn't happen often. I went up to a PNWR AX at Bremerton this last July....a huge layout ....no lines, few cones, nearly impossible to memorize by walking....prolly more than 1/2 mile long on a side. It could have used some lines.....I stunk up the joint. It would take some gettin' used to, I guess. |
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| ppickerell |
Nov 15 2004, 12:06 PM
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#64
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914 addicted Group: Members Posts: 1,679 Joined: 14-October 03 From: Pleasanton, CA. Member No.: 1,246 |
JP,
I have not run many events, but the lines sure freed up my tiny brain to concentrate on the car as opposed to hunting for the next gate. At the event previous to this 1/2 the field was DNF for most of the day. That is no fun. This course was short and very tight. Some italian guy named andretti left his semi in the way and forced the layout into a nasty cone killing Z turn. But I say bring on the lines. |
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| Randal |
Nov 15 2004, 12:43 PM
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#65
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,446 Joined: 29-May 03 From: Los Altos, CA Member No.: 750 |
Is lining a course wimpy?
I'd suggest reading Roger Johnson great design book and taking his comments into consideration before making any decisions about this. My Webpage I've lined the course I’ve designed this year as I wanted the exercise to be based upon drivers finding the best lines and improving their times, which is a challenge in itself, not simply finding their way around the course. What I'm trying to accomplish in designing a course is creating a racing venue that people can think about and improve upon quickly, as opposed to (again) trying to find their way around the course, which creates frustration. Another way of looking at this is to look at results. Where we've run "unlined" (sea of cones) courses the number of DNF was high, i.e., in some cases over 30%. A DNF means that someone went off the course somewhere and every time that happens it isn’t safe. Also take a look at the SCCA Nationals course on Roger's manual. All lined, must be a reason. And what can we say about road courses…. Right, they are “in effect” lined as well, to keep all those fast guys on the track. |
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| ppickerell |
Nov 15 2004, 12:50 PM
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#66
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914 addicted Group: Members Posts: 1,679 Joined: 14-October 03 From: Pleasanton, CA. Member No.: 1,246 |
If you want to recruit newbies to the sport , use lines. If you want to keep all to yourself go for the "sea of cones" effect. My wife had a lousy time at Candlestick a couple of weeks back with all but 1 run DNF but really enjoyed herself yesterday with no DNF's and a 6 second improvement from her first run to the last.
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| Randal |
Nov 15 2004, 01:09 PM
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#67
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,446 Joined: 29-May 03 From: Los Altos, CA Member No.: 750 |
QUOTE My wife had a lousy time at Candlestick a couple of weeks back with all but 1 run DNF but really enjoyed herself yesterday with no DNF's and a 6 second improvement from her first run to the last. My exact point. The Candlestick Halloween course would have been tough enough in any event, let alone not fully lined. To make thing more complicated, the course was run backwards in the PM and a big section physically changed. I kind of wondered about the run backwards part, as I don’t think John Sidel would have designed a course that had to be changed (for safety I’m guessing) if he had been told about it in advance. |
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| GTeener |
Nov 15 2004, 01:14 PM
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#68
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914 Girl Group: Members Posts: 2,348 Joined: 25-June 04 From: SillyCon Valley Member No.: 2,249 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(ppickerell @ Nov 14 2004, 06:25 PM) and this I was at the track event and at the drivers meeting in the morning they told the intermediate drivers to be careful. The irony being that these crashes happened by 'advanced' drivers... The WRX I heard went off track (2nd lap of the day) just enough to get hooked in the mud which grabbed and flipped it. Bad day to drive a silver car for sure! Too bad you didn't get a picture of the vette's license plate... more irony... Awsome day for me though (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving-girl.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif) |
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| GTeener |
Nov 15 2004, 01:17 PM
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#69
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914 Girl Group: Members Posts: 2,348 Joined: 25-June 04 From: SillyCon Valley Member No.: 2,249 Region Association: Northern California |
Proper track line vs not (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)
Attached image(s) 
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| J P Stein |
Nov 15 2004, 01:24 PM
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#70
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Irrelevant old fart Group: Members Posts: 8,797 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Vancouver, WA Member No.: 45 Region Association: None |
I have no problem with lining a course....unless I gotta do it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
I do have a problem with constricting entrances & exits. I do have a problem with a sea of cones, lined or no......but as I said, each club does things different and one can get used to anything. Personally, I like courses that the ought6's like ....lined or no (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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| Randal |
Nov 15 2004, 03:40 PM
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#71
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,446 Joined: 29-May 03 From: Los Altos, CA Member No.: 750 |
QUOTE Proper track line vs not What a great picture. Perfect example of why we have instructors. Notice where the instructors are looking; now look where the drivers are looking. Classic! Wish we had the audio! |
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| Brad Roberts |
Nov 15 2004, 04:36 PM
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#72
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914 Freak! Group: Members Posts: 19,148 Joined: 23-December 02 Member No.: 8 Region Association: None |
SteveN broke the inside control arm ear on the 21 car. Broke it big time. You can actually see the right rear tire in pics posted here "out of whack" I watched him go around and walked up to the car and asked him straight out: did you break the inside suspension ear ?? It wasnt cracked... it BROKE.
I personally think it cracked several event back.. B |
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| Randal |
Nov 15 2004, 04:43 PM
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#73
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,446 Joined: 29-May 03 From: Los Altos, CA Member No.: 750 |
QUOTE I personally think it cracked several event back.. Thought so.... See Brad, there is more than one driver out there so involved in driving that we don't always feel what is happening to the car. I checked my rear tires before putting it up on blocks and guess what....there is still rubber there. I wasn't hooked up at the rear and was in automatic to compensate. Wrong control arm setting... OK Roberts, your right (again)... damn! |
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| GTeener |
Nov 15 2004, 04:44 PM
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#74
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914 Girl Group: Members Posts: 2,348 Joined: 25-June 04 From: SillyCon Valley Member No.: 2,249 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(Randal @ Nov 15 2004, 01:40 PM) QUOTE Proper track line vs not What a great picture. Perfect example of why we have instructors. Notice where the instructors are looking; now look where the drivers are looking. Classic! Wish we had the audio! Ya, I was suprised to see this dramatic picture in our set too. The instructors looks were not lost one either (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) My instructor was Laura Thompson. She was great. She was telling me to hold my line and stay close to him (469) so when we got to the straight away I could pass him. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving-girl.gif) |
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| Martin Baker |
Nov 15 2004, 04:50 PM
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#75
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I just heard I sold my cars! Group: Members Posts: 1,140 Joined: 11-February 03 Member No.: 290 Region Association: Northern California 
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QUOTE(GTeener @ Nov 15 2004, 12:14 PM) Too bad you didn't get a picture of the vette's license plate... more irony... ....BU BYE.... Attached image(s) 
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| Brad Roberts |
Nov 15 2004, 04:51 PM
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#76
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914 Freak! Group: Members Posts: 19,148 Joined: 23-December 02 Member No.: 8 Region Association: None |
Notice the amount of POSITIVE camber in this wheel ?? These Goodyear slicks damn near run "straight up" with little to NO neg. camber. Also.. the tire is tucking in under the car in a left hand turn... NOT good.
B |
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| GTeener |
Nov 15 2004, 04:53 PM
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#77
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914 Girl Group: Members Posts: 2,348 Joined: 25-June 04 From: SillyCon Valley Member No.: 2,249 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(Martin Baker @ Nov 15 2004, 02:50 PM) QUOTE(GTeener @ Nov 15 2004, 12:14 PM) Too bad you didn't get a picture of the vette's license plate... more irony... .... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/clap56.gif) Yeay! Glad someone got the picture of his plates. |
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| GTeener |
Nov 15 2004, 04:57 PM
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#78
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914 Girl Group: Members Posts: 2,348 Joined: 25-June 04 From: SillyCon Valley Member No.: 2,249 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(Randal @ Nov 15 2004, 01:40 PM) QUOTE Proper track line vs not What a great picture. Perfect example of why we have instructors. Notice where the instructors are looking; now look where the drivers are looking. Classic! Wish we had the audio! And actually at the time I don't remember feeling like I was going to hit 469. The camera is playing tricks with the angle. Here is the follow up picture, where I have to let him go because I can't pass him in the turn and need to wait for his passing signal. Attached image(s) 
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| Brad Roberts |
Nov 15 2004, 05:00 PM
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#79
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914 Freak! Group: Members Posts: 19,148 Joined: 23-December 02 Member No.: 8 Region Association: None |
Yes. I have your car cover in my truck Gwen. I pulled it out for you and stuck it in my truck...
B |
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| GTeener |
Nov 15 2004, 05:03 PM
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#80
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914 Girl Group: Members Posts: 2,348 Joined: 25-June 04 From: SillyCon Valley Member No.: 2,249 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(Brad Roberts @ Nov 15 2004, 03:00 PM) Yes. I have your car cover in my truck Gwen. I pulled it out for you and stuck it in my truck... B Excellent. Thanks! |
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