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> Factory 2.0 L Exhaust Nut vs Copper Nut, A Compairson of the Two
914Sixer
post Feb 26 2015, 10:12 PM
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This might explain difference in cost between the two. The 2.0 nut is used and the copper is new. Note the copper one has elongated hole.


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GeorgeRud
post Feb 26 2015, 10:20 PM
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I believe the elongated center in the copper nut is done to provide a self locking feature. Regular locknuts cannot work in the high heat exhaust area as the nylon ring in the locknut doesn't hold properly, but the deformed copper will.
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McMark
post Feb 27 2015, 10:22 AM
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Yup, the top threads are squished. It's the way most locking nuts are done. Nylock is fine for a lot of things, but if they're gonna be by a heat source, forget it. This includes clutch cables.. The squished thread lock nuts are destined with a certain amount of deformation, so they won't damage the studs...
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Dave_Darling
post Feb 27 2015, 10:59 AM
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Sixer, can you look at the OEM nut to see if there is a slice in the side anywhere? I remember one from the exhaust nuts I took off my car way back when...

--DD
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Cap'n Krusty
post Feb 27 2015, 11:10 AM
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I have one sitting right here. No slice, no deformity, no plating and no no. Just a steel nut with a thick flange on one end and Helicoiled threads on the inside. They are NOT self locking nuts, nor were they meant to be such.

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JamesM
post Feb 27 2015, 12:05 PM
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The copper nuts are awesome at pulling exhaust studs!

OEM nuts are great if you can find them.
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Al Meredith
post Feb 27 2015, 12:13 PM
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I like the copper nuts BUT I run a 8X125 tap through the nut to eliminate the "pinch"
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Cap'n Krusty
post Feb 27 2015, 12:23 PM
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Again, you're joining the ranks of those who call those things "copper" nuts. They're NOT copper, they're STEEL, with a copper plating. Clearing out the "pinch" makes them regular nuts with a hefty price tag.

The Cap'n
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rjames
post Feb 27 2015, 12:46 PM
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Okay, so what's the proper replacement for the originals and install procedure? Sound like the copper PLATED ones aren't recommended for fear of stripping the threads that receive the exhaust stud.
And if a regular nut is recommended, what should one use to keep it in place? I recall Jake recommending milk of magnesia on the threads.
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Al Meredith
post Feb 27 2015, 12:46 PM
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Correct ! I like them because they don't slip through a socket.
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JamesM
post Feb 27 2015, 12:58 PM
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QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Feb 27 2015, 11:23 AM) *

Again, you're joining the ranks of those who call those things "copper" nuts. They're NOT copper, they're STEEL, with a copper plating. Clearing out the "pinch" makes them regular nuts with a hefty price tag.

The Cap'n


Force of habit as that is how they are advertised EVERYWHERE.

Personally if I can't find OEM ones I will go with these:

http://vwparts.aircooled.net/ACN-Flanged-R...-p/acn-nuts.htm

REALLY nice when dealing with larger OD header stubs.
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914Sixer
post Feb 27 2015, 04:27 PM
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James, you may find the nuts your are looking at are too small in diameter for the exhaust flange on HE's.
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Woody
post Feb 27 2015, 04:50 PM
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QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Feb 27 2015, 12:23 PM) *

Again, you're joining the ranks of those who call those things "copper" nuts. They're NOT copper, they're STEEL, with a copper plating. Clearing out the "pinch" makes them regular nuts with a hefty price tag.

The Cap'n



Exactly. The copper plated nuts are still in use on new Porsches as well. A good portion of the nuts used on the current cars have a pinch or dimple and are one time use.
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pete000
post Feb 27 2015, 06:51 PM
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QUOTE(JamesM @ Feb 27 2015, 10:58 AM) *

QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Feb 27 2015, 11:23 AM) *

Again, you're joining the ranks of those who call those things "copper" nuts. They're NOT copper, they're STEEL, with a copper plating. Clearing out the "pinch" makes them regular nuts with a hefty price tag.

The Cap'n


Force of habit as that is how they are advertised EVERYWHERE.

Personally if I can't find OEM ones I will go with these:

http://vwparts.aircooled.net/ACN-Flanged-R...-p/acn-nuts.htm

REALLY nice when dealing with larger OD header stubs.



These are the ones I went with. They worked fine with my SSi's and were no trouble to install.


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PlaysWithCars
post Feb 28 2015, 08:45 PM
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QUOTE(Dave_Darling @ Feb 27 2015, 08:59 AM) *

Sixer, can you look at the OEM nut to see if there is a slice in the side anywhere? I remember one from the exhaust nuts I took off my car way back when...

--DD


I remember the same thing on the last ones I replaced. The slit allowed the nut to be slightly bent across the axis to create a locking feature instead of squashing the nut perpendicular to the axis.
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patssle
post Feb 28 2015, 08:57 PM
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I went through this myself last year when completing my /6 conversion. I read posts of people having problems with copper lock nuts pulling out the exhaust studs. Just not worth the risk IMHO.

I have a mix of flanged and regular nuts on my exhaust. It seems my MSDS headers have welds that get in the way of the flanges - so that was an issue but minor.
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JamesM
post Feb 28 2015, 11:45 PM
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QUOTE(914Sixer @ Feb 27 2015, 03:27 PM) *

James, you may find the nuts your are looking at are too small in diameter for the exhaust flange on HE's.



The flange is still 13mm. I have used them before.
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aircooledtechguy
post Mar 3 2015, 09:24 AM
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As the Cap'n mentioned, OEM nuts were steel with a helicoiled thread. It's precisely this helicoil thread that keeps them from bonding to the studs in the first place which is why this nut type is so desirable. VW also used this type of nut on their motors as exhaust nuts from the factory albeit without the shoulder on them.

Unfortunately, I have found no where that this type of helicoil nut is now made. However, the same style of nuts are used to hold the transmissions together on the 914 (without the shoulder). Yes, the same 8x1.25x13 with the helicoil centers are likely holding your transmission together right now. Since the transmissions don't get hot enough to really need this type of protection, I replace the trans nuts with standard nylocs and save these special nuts for exhaust nuts.

Just an FYI for those of you wanting a real seize-free exhaust nut. . . (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
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914werke
post Mar 3 2015, 09:39 AM
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Or if your a hoarder (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) your already sitting on a stash of em....
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Phoenix914
post Mar 3 2015, 09:51 AM
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Is it appropriate to use something like this on the exhaust nuts?

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