 Porsche 914 Starter/Wiring/Vacuum Hose Questions, Wiring and Vacuum Hose Questions |
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| 91422.7 |
 Mar 29 2015, 09:12 PM
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#1
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Newbie  Group: Members Posts: 36 Joined: 8-October 14 From: Eugene, Oregon Member No.: 17,991 Region Association: Upper MidWest  |
Having problems getting the starter to engage! I have a 1970 Porsche 914 which I've just installed a 1975 914 2.0L F.I. engine. I've attached a photo of the starter hookup. It appears from the starter solenoid there is a blue wire or red/black wire that suppose to go to the ignition switch! Does that wire actually go to the Fuse Relay Block Panel first then on to the ignition switch? Question #2: from the picture you can see the Air Aux Regulator which has 2 outlets, one comes from the air breather, where does the other one go? Question #3: One of the injectors slides in and out pretty easy, the other 3 don't, is that because the one has a faulty inner rubber seal? Question #4: Is there a problem using the 1970 Fuse Relay Block (Engine Compartment) since I'm using a later model (1975) 2.0L F.I. engine or do I need to upgrade to a FRB out of a 1975 914? Thanks again for all your help!
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| JeffBowlsby |
Mar 29 2015, 10:27 PM
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#2
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914 Wiring Harnesses Group: Members Posts: 8,788 Joined: 7-January 03 From: San Ramon CA Member No.: 104 Region Association: None 
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Two issues I see:
That big yellow wire on the igniotin harness that is just hanging, must attach to the starter. See here for the vacuum hose layout for the AAR: http://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/TechNotebook.htm That ignition harness you have is not correct for a 75 2.0L, it is an Ljet harness. Will not work with a standard 2.0L setup. The relay board is compatible with all 914/4 cars. |
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| 91422.7 |
Mar 29 2015, 10:44 PM
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#3
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Newbie Group: Members Posts: 36 Joined: 8-October 14 From: Eugene, Oregon Member No.: 17,991 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
QUOTE(Jeff Bowlsby @ Mar 29 2015, 09:27 PM)  Two issues I see: That big yellow wire on the igniotin harness that is just hanging, must attach to the starter. See here for the vacuum hose layout for the AAR: http://bowlsby.net/914/Classic/TechNotebook.htm That ignition harness you have is not correct for a 75 2.0L, it is an Ljet harness. Will not work with a standard 2.0L setup. The relay board is compatible with all 914/4 cars. Ok Jeff, thanks again...I'm on it! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) |
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| SLITS |
Mar 30 2015, 06:52 AM
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#4
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"This Utah shit is HARSH!" Group: Benefactors Posts: 13,602 Joined: 22-February 04 From: SoCal Mountains ... Member No.: 1,696 Region Association: None  |
The item in your last image is the AAR (auxiliary air regulator). One end is connected to the large inlet on your plenum via stacked elbow and the other to the air cleaner. Provides auxiliary air on cold startup (higher idle).
I don't really understand how your starter is wired. It looks like you have a "hot start relay" in the system. The big yellow wire is normally connected to the spade terminal on the starter. It comes from the ignition switch to the relay board and then out to the starter via the engine harness. With the Bosch relay in place I am not sure of the wiring as I use a Ford solenoid/relay for the same purpose. |
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| 91422.7 |
Mar 30 2015, 09:11 AM
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#5
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Newbie Group: Members Posts: 36 Joined: 8-October 14 From: Eugene, Oregon Member No.: 17,991 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
I forgot the wiring harness that runs from the starter to the Engine Bay Relay Board was taken off of a 75 914 I think! I've attached a better picture of the wiring harness around the starter along with a picture of the wiring of the relay kit I was trying to follow! On my wiring harness the blue wire coming off the relay #85 is attached to a larger yellow wire which runs back to the Engine Bay Relay Board I think, assuming it runs on to the Ignition Switch! Can I just bypass the the fuse in the drawing along with the Low Voltage Relay Kit?
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| JeffBowlsby |
Mar 30 2015, 09:34 AM
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#6
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914 Wiring Harnesses Group: Members Posts: 8,788 Joined: 7-January 03 From: San Ramon CA Member No.: 104 Region Association: None
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Lose the relay gobbledegook. Hook it up correctly, no relay needed, you are just inviting problems with that mess. Be sure your grounds and wiring connections are clean.
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| 91422.7 |
Mar 30 2015, 10:29 AM
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#7
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Newbie Group: Members Posts: 36 Joined: 8-October 14 From: Eugene, Oregon Member No.: 17,991 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
QUOTE(Jeff Bowlsby @ Mar 30 2015, 08:34 AM) Lose the relay gobbledegook. Hook it up correctly, no relay needed, you are just inviting problems with that mess. Be sure your grounds and wiring connections are clean. Ok, thanks again for all your help, I will give it a try! Have a great day! |
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| Kansas 914 |
Mar 30 2015, 10:38 AM
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#8
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,999 Joined: 1-March 03 From: Durango, Colorado Member No.: 373 Region Association: Rocky Mountains
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QUOTE(Jeff Bowlsby @ Mar 30 2015, 09:34 AM) Lose the relay gobbledegook. Hook it up correctly, no relay needed, you are just inviting problems with that mess. Be sure your grounds and wiring connections are clean. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) |
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| SLITS |
Mar 30 2015, 11:01 AM
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#9
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"This Utah shit is HARSH!" Group: Benefactors Posts: 13,602 Joined: 22-February 04 From: SoCal Mountains ... Member No.: 1,696 Region Association: None |
I disagree with you two experts. The relay takes the load off the ignition switch .... which presently are crap from China. A good amount of them don't work out of the box. Not a band-aid ... just a way of saving the good German switches.
Oh well .............. |
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| Elliot Cannon |
Mar 30 2015, 11:09 AM
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#10
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914 Guru Group: Retired Members Posts: 8,487 Joined: 29-December 06 From: Paso Robles Ca. (Central coast) Member No.: 7,407 Region Association: None 
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I agree with SLITS (did I just say that)? I've had a Ford relay on my car for 11 years and it works great and helps a lot to protect the POS start switch.
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| JeffBowlsby |
Mar 30 2015, 12:27 PM
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#11
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914 Wiring Harnesses Group: Members Posts: 8,788 Joined: 7-January 03 From: San Ramon CA Member No.: 104 Region Association: None
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OK you guys....I never professed to be an expurt in anything....
Relays are OK if'n they are hooked up correctly, correct wire gauges, clean grounds, etc...the comments were related to the photos above that showed everything wrong, it would likely leave our comrade on the side of the road somewhere. Not looking to start a rebellion. I have never had a starter relay on my 914s, been driving them regularly with periods as a daily driver, for nearly 20 years and only recently changed the factory original ignition switch after it had been in service for 39 years. |
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| isdyl |
Nov 8 2018, 04:32 AM
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#12
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Member Group: Members Posts: 113 Joined: 13-June 18 From: Woking, UK Member No.: 22,217 Region Association: England |
Hi - Sorry to resurrect an old thread but I'm having a similar starting problem which I think is due to a voltage drop between the ignition switch and the starter solenoid (yellow wire). It starts sometimes fine, but other times there is a short delay with the key held in the 'crank' position, and sometimes nothing at all. I was thinking of installing a 4-pole solenoid to eliminate the problem which I have done on a VW camper with success, but am just thinking of trying to clear any poor connections first. From what I can see the yellow wire from the starter solenoid goes back to the Regulator Plate. Please see attached a pic of my plate which is in a pretty dirty condition. I just wondered if anyone could tell me which wire/plug goes from the Reg Plate back to the ignition switch please? Also I should add that the car has been converted to carbs so thats why not all wires are present on the plate.
Many thanks Attached image(s) 
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| barefoot |
Nov 8 2018, 06:53 AM
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#13
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,336 Joined: 19-March 13 From: Charleston SC Member No.: 15,673 Region Association: South East States
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QUOTE(isdyl @ Nov 8 2018, 05:32 AM) Hi - Sorry to resurrect an old thread but I'm having a similar starting problem which I think is due to a voltage drop between the ignition switch and the starter solenoid (yellow wire). It starts sometimes fine, but other times there is a short delay with the key held in the 'crank' position, and sometimes nothing at all. I was thinking of installing a 4-pole solenoid to eliminate the problem which I have done on a VW camper with success, but am just thinking of trying to clear any poor connections first. From what I can see the yellow wire from the starter solenoid goes back to the Regulator Plate. Please see attached a pic of my plate which is in a pretty dirty condition. I just wondered if anyone could tell me which wire/plug goes from the Reg Plate back to the ignition switch please? Also I should add that the car has been converted to carbs so thats why not all wires are present on the plate. Many thanks Here's a diagram of the relay board, you can trace the wire going back to the ign switch on there.  |
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| isdyl |
Nov 8 2018, 08:08 AM
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#14
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Member Group: Members Posts: 113 Joined: 13-June 18 From: Woking, UK Member No.: 22,217 Region Association: England |
Great diagram - Thanks!
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| dr914@autoatlanta.com |
Nov 8 2018, 08:48 AM
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#15
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 8,114 Joined: 3-January 07 From: atlanta georgia Member No.: 7,418 Region Association: None |
usually if there is a delay the ignition switch may be bad, when you have voltage drop, the starter either clicks or instantly has voltage to the yellow wire but does not engage the starter
QUOTE(isdyl @ Nov 8 2018, 03:32 AM) Hi - Sorry to resurrect an old thread but I'm having a similar starting problem which I think is due to a voltage drop between the ignition switch and the starter solenoid (yellow wire). It starts sometimes fine, but other times there is a short delay with the key held in the 'crank' position, and sometimes nothing at all. I was thinking of installing a 4-pole solenoid to eliminate the problem which I have done on a VW camper with success, but am just thinking of trying to clear any poor connections first. From what I can see the yellow wire from the starter solenoid goes back to the Regulator Plate. Please see attached a pic of my plate which is in a pretty dirty condition. I just wondered if anyone could tell me which wire/plug goes from the Reg Plate back to the ignition switch please? Also I should add that the car has been converted to carbs so thats why not all wires are present on the plate. Many thanks |
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| isdyl |
Nov 8 2018, 11:42 AM
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#16
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Member Group: Members Posts: 113 Joined: 13-June 18 From: Woking, UK Member No.: 22,217 Region Association: England |
Thanks - I'll check that out too. Regards Dylan
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| isdyl |
Nov 9 2018, 05:41 AM
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#17
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Member Group: Members Posts: 113 Joined: 13-June 18 From: Woking, UK Member No.: 22,217 Region Association: England |
Hi - no it's not the ignition switch as I took the wires off and tried 'hot wiring'. Same symptoms - a delay and then sometimes cranking. I'm getting 8 volts at the solenoid so I'll try cleaning up the plug connections on the plate, and maybe just connecting the two wires together and see if that works. If no good I'll just have to fit the little black relay. I'll install it near the relay/regulator plate as it doesn't look waterproof.
Dylan |
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| isdyl |
Nov 9 2018, 11:20 AM
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#18
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Member Group: Members Posts: 113 Joined: 13-June 18 From: Woking, UK Member No.: 22,217 Region Association: England |
Ok, so I cleaned up the two large plugs on the plate by spraying with wd40 and pulling them on and off a few times and the car fired up no problems. It didn't even need to crank much which is normally unheard of. It's not conclusive as I haven't needed to crank much to start but there is certainly a massive improvement. I must have improved other connections too, like maybe to the coil.
I guess in theory there should be no need for an additional relay if the ignition switch is good. Wires don't just increase their resistance - just bad connections between them. There must be another connection somewhere as the yellow wire ends up red/black by the time it gets to the ignition switch. |
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