Rebuild a 2.7L or 3.0L six motor, which is cheaper? Options

[boxsterfan]

Which /6 motor is cheaper to rebuild? 2.7L or the 3.0L?

1. Assume core motor is in good condtion and no crazy findings when you tear it down.
2. Assume you are building the motor for longevity
3. You are putting this in a 914/6 conversion (was /4)

[jcd914]

3.0L
The Aluminum case of the 3.0L won't kill your whole project budget at the machine shop, the mag case of a 2.7L might.

Jim

[Mark Henry]

I'd say about the same, but there's so many variables. No two rebuilds are the same.
Even if you think 2 cores may be in equil shape, you have no idea till you get in there.
One to keep in mind is, not counting the price of the core, it will ballpark cost you just as much to rebuild a 2.0 as a 3.6

Personally I have a 3.0 and a 2.7, both in pretty good shape with inspected good std/std cranks. For now I'm keeping the 2.7 as a just in case back-up core.
I built the 3.0

[boxsterfan]

What's a good price these days for a 2.7L vs 3.0L core for rebuild?

I'm finding the 2.7L motors about $3-4K cheaper....

[Steve]

Lots of pro's and cons
2.7 Pro's
Magnesium case = lighter
Can use early 914-6/911 2.0 flywheel and stock 914-4 2.0 clutch. Clutch feels just like a stock 914-4 2.0
2.7 Cons
Case is weaker. check out Bruce Anderson 911 performance hand book. Might need case savers, timeserts and special head studs. I used to have a 2.7 and when it started to pull head studs, i sold it and bought a used 3.2 from a wrecking yard.
Cheaper than overhauling the 2.7. 3.2 stock injection is really nice, but I wasn't happy with the 914-4 gearing and ended up spending big bucks for a 916 gear box.
3.0 pro's
Case is much stronger and doesn't require the above
Known as the most reliable 911 motor
3.0 cons
Heavier
Requires special adapter flywheel to be used with 901/914 trans, unless you convert your 914 gearbox to a pull type clutch. I was not a fan of the special KEP bus clutch adapter flywheel. Harder to push compared to stock

My advice is think about your end goal before plunking tons of money down. Try to drive both. Get multiple estimates to rebuild both correctly

[bigkensteele]

3.0L
The Aluminum case of the 3.0L won't kill your whole project budget at the machine shop, the mag case of a 2.7L might.

Jim

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) without a doubt.

I am doing a 2.7 because I got a screaming good deal on it (Thanks again, Thomas - Tschrifield). If you don't already have case-savers for your head studs, they are a must and will set you back hundreds that you wouldn't have to spend on an aluminum case. I would also rather have an aluminum case for longevity and strength.

The good thing about 2.7s is that cores tend to be cheaper, so this may offset your machining costs. If you aren't shooting for 250 hp, I wouldn't rule them out if you find a good deal.

[jimkelly]

unless money is no object, don't stretch your budget too thin. there is nothing wrong with a great running 2.0 four. a six will be faster, if you don't mind speeding tickets. don't overlook the benefits of tight: suspension, brakes, steering, etc. when it comes to joy to drive. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

[boxsterfan]

3.0L
The Aluminum case of the 3.0L won't kill your whole project budget at the machine shop, the mag case of a 2.7L might.

Jim

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) without a doubt.

I am doing a 2.7 because I got a screaming good deal on it (Thanks again, Thomas - Tschrifield). If you don't already have case-savers for your head studs, they are a must and will set you back hundreds that you wouldn't have to spend on an aluminum case. I would also rather have an aluminum case for longevity and strength.

The good thing about 2.7s is that cores tend to be cheaper, so this may offset your machining costs. If you aren't shooting for 250 hp, I wouldn't rule them out if you find a good deal.

Yeah, that seems to be the rub. When there is thousands price difference between them it starts to get attractive. I'm really not aiming for mega-horsepower. Anywhere near 200HP will be fine for this street car. That's quite an upgrade anyway from the stock 2.0L.

[Dave_Darling]

Which /6 motor is cheaper to rebuild? 2.7L or the 3.0L?

None of the above... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Budget five figures to rebuild either one.

--DD

[jimkelly]

a totally tight car with 115-125 hp would be plenty enjoyable and cost a shit load less. just saying. what is the status of your car at this moment?

[bigkensteele]

If you don't already have Wayne Dempsey's 911 rebuilding book, you should get a copy. Lots of great information in there about engine combinations that work and their resulting characteristics. And Bruce Anderson's 911 Performance Handbook is like drinking from a fire hose.

I am also shooting for somewhere around 200 hp. My current plan is to ditch the CIS, 9.5:1 JE pistons, S (ish) Crane cams (another deal from Thomas), and probably Megasquirt for induction.

I got very lucky with my motor. When I tore it apart, it appears to have a pretty fresh rebuild, and it already had Nicasil cylinders (can still see the factory cross-hatching!!!) and case savers or time-serts (can't tell which). I could probably clean it up and put it back together without even replacing the bearings, but I want to build a nice tight engine.

If you aren't in a hurry, do the research to help you decide what you want to end up with, and then just wait/watch for good deals on the components that will get you there. Best of luck!

[boxsterfan]

a totally tight car with 115-125 hp would be plenty enjoyable and cost a shit load less. just saying. what is the status of your car at this moment?

Car is still half apart in the garage. Motor is still in it.

I'm kicking the tires here a little bit. My intentions had been to have a 2270 built with ITB's and megasquirt setup.

[mepstein]

Just like our cars, buy the best one you can. The more you have to replace, modify, upgrade, repair, ect, the more it will cost compared to buying a good running engine.

[mepstein]

3.0L
The Aluminum case of the 3.0L won't kill your whole project budget at the machine shop, the mag case of a 2.7L might.

Jim

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) without a doubt.

I am doing a 2.7 because I got a screaming good deal on it (Thanks again, Thomas - Tschrifield). If you don't already have case-savers for your head studs, they are a must and will set you back hundreds that you wouldn't have to spend on an aluminum case. I would also rather have an aluminum case for longevity and strength.

The good thing about 2.7s is that cores tend to be cheaper, so this may offset your machining costs. If you aren't shooting for 250 hp, I wouldn't rule them out if you find a good deal.

Yeah, that seems to be the rub. When there is thousands price difference between them it starts to get attractive. I'm really not aiming for mega-horsepower. Anywhere near 200HP will be fine for this street car. That's quite an upgrade anyway from the stock 2.0L.

Stock 3.2's actually make around 207-210. The smaller motors make considerably less unless they're an S motor with mfi.

[0396]

Which /6 motor is cheaper to rebuild? 2.7L or the 3.0L?

None of the above... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Budget five figures to rebuild either one.

--DD

Wise advice. What's your budget? Unlimited, go 3.6

[larryM]

QUOTE O.P: "Anywhere near 200HP will be fine for this street car."


a stock 3.2 with Motronic-DME will give you 205-217 hp - with no more drama to install in your conversion project than any other -6 choice

getting 200hp out of a 2.7 or smaller is not an average nor cheap build - (BTDT - a 2.8 on a 2.4, and a 2.7RS on a new case)

the advice from the guys above is spot-on

the "cheapest' trick is to find a decent complete 3.2 without big miles on it - but that's mostly a "barn find" dream

(a few yrs ago PMS told me they'd quit doing 3.2 conversions cuz they could not find any decent ones that didn't need a rebuild)

if you find a 3.2 needing top end work (highly likely on any older 3.2), be aware that the bottom ends will go 250K easy, so you may avoid a complete teardown)

fwiw last year i sold a 3.2 with 188K miles on it, needing a valve job, with all the injection, etc; but no alt-fan & no DME or harness - i advertised it at $5500 on Craigs and had 6 guys panting for it in one day - a guy came all the way from LA for it with cash in hand (a DME & harness is another grand, alt-fan another $600) - (i previously advert it here on world for $7500 COMPLETE with no takers, so i decided it was worth more parted out & stripped it to long block, sold the FW, clutch & various other parts - got more than my original ask in the end)

best -shop for a whole wrecked Carrera & hope for one with acceptable miles on it or some verifiable evidence of prior work - just have your checkbook ready

[Steve]

I lucked out!!! Back in 2000 a wrecking yard up north was trying to sell a 1984 gray market 911. They finally gave up and parted it out. I bought the motor. It's a 231 hp euro 3.2. Runs great!! I paid $5200 for it and sold the exhaust and extra parts for around $500

[Mark Henry]

Just to keep it honest.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)
Unless you have horseshoes up your ass, you're not likely to be finding any 3.2 for $5-6K these days.

[mepstein]

Just to keep it honest.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)
Unless you have horseshoes up your ass, you're not likely to be finding any 3.2 for $5-6K these days.

Not a 3.2 but a twin plug 3.0 mfi for $4k, well, yes...
(Needs a top end)

[Mark Henry]

Just to keep it honest.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)
Unless you have horseshoes up your ass, you're not likely to be finding any 3.2 for $5-6K these days.

Not a 3.2 but a twin plug 3.0 mfi for $4k, well, yes...

Is that what you found? I thought a 3.0 would be CIS?
I know some guys get lucky and some guys can wait till they get lucky, but it's not the norm.