Coil Over assembly..., I just gotta be sure Options

[tygaboy]

Can I get a confirmation of what else, if anything, I need as I assemble the coil over kit?

Is there some sort of bushing/washer that lives on the shaft UNDER the top spring hat that supports it?

All I got was the plastic washer that slides down the shaft and sit on the shock body.

I watched this video and nothing is mentioned or used.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGIrZ1sJVdc

It just seems like there'd be something more so I figured better to ask and be safe than sorry.

Thanks in advance.

Chris

[914forme]

Tangerine strut tops, you have 2 of the spacers that fit into the mono ball. You might need a spacer to keep the shock from binding against the tower.

hat

Spacer -yours if needed

Chris's spacer

Monoball

Chris's spacer (2)

Then nut

Can't see the top spacer due to the angle but it is there

[tygaboy]

Stephen,
Right, I'm good on what goes on top of the hat, after it's installed.
I'm wondering if there something that goes on the shaft BEFORE the top hat.
The shaft has a couple steps at the top and the top hat doesn't sit on that shaft in a very convincing way.

Does that make sense?

[cwpeden]

Bump Stops

[914forme]

Sort of.

You could add a bump stop, that slide down to the lowest step.

Then the spring plate, it just sits down to the point where it hits the next step, then everything else.

If your springs are not long, it will not feel very good, until it is in the car, I zip tie my springs to the hat, and will be running tenders just to make up the difference when in full droop mode.

My car used to sit super low, don't think I would ever hit full droop before something else stopped the movement.

Could always add limiting straps etc....

I will most likely change over to a 12 to 14" spring just to make sure I am father down the sleeve on the coil overs. My old ones where about an 1.5" from the top.

I can go out to the shop and take pictures is that the rebel racing kit? I also have a set of Colemann racing units, I like the hats on them better. No slot to slip over the shaft just a simple drilled hole, leaves you with a bit more of a positive feel.

[Larmo63]

I hate the CLUNK sound my springs make when they seat themselves back in place.

I need to solve the issue eventually.

[PlaysWithCars]

I hate the CLUNK sound my springs make when they seat themselves back in place.

I need to solve the issue eventually.

I used helper springs sourced from Summit Racing and haven't experienced a clunk yet.

[Mark Henry]

I hate the CLUNK sound my springs make when they seat themselves back in place.

I need to solve the issue eventually.

Drill a couple of holes, HD zip ties...done.

[tygaboy]

OK, I'm not doing a good job of explaining my problem... the one about the shock, that is.

In my case, the top hat shaft hole seems like it's not the correct size.
You can see in the original pic, there are two steps in the shock shaft.
As I slide the hat onto the shaft, it contacts the first step.
I get that the spring is supporting the car but that little lip is taking the load from the shaft and is serving as the clamping location as I tighten the top nut.

I talked with Tony (Cracker) this morning and he patiently listened through my ranting. In the end he said what I think answers my question:

The step in the shaft should be riding up against the lower stepped spacer (that comes with the Tangerine kit) that fits into the spherical bearing.

This would suggest that the hole in my spring hat isn't correct and needs to be opened up to slide past those steps.

Stephen, does your spring hat contact anything on the shaft?

I ask because in your pic, you show no threads coming past the top nut. That's the same thing I was seeing. It could be yours isn't fully assembled but I just wanted to ask.

Here's Tony's car. He's running the same Koni yellows as me. Note all the threads... Something ain't right in my set up.

[jd74914]

You're saying your top hat never hits a stop on the shaft-so it would fall all the way to the damper body if there was no spring?

My Coleman tops are the same. I'll grab a picture for you.

[jd74914]

Yeah, they don't have any stops. I think they might be this way to avoid scuffing the damper shaft since the springs are relatively self aligning as they compress.

As an aside-it's kinda nice having an office I can keep car parts under the desk. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[tygaboy]

You're saying your top hat never hits a stop on the shaft-so it would fall all the way to the damper body if there was no spring?

My Coleman tops are the same. I'll grab a picture for you.

A pic would be great. And I'm saying my hat does contact that first lip but it sure doesn't seem like a "positive" fit that should/would take any sort of load.
I think that must be why Tony's car shows so much thread out the top: He opened up the hat so it does slide all the way down so he's "lost" the thickness of the hat in his assembly, allowing more thread to poke out the top.

Anyway, am I just being paranoid? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

[tygaboy]

Yeah, they don't have any stops. I think they might be this way to avoid scuffing the damper shaft since the springs are relatively self aligning as they compress.

As an aside-it's kinda nice having an office I can keep car parts under the desk. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Ah HA! No contact between the hat and the shaft step! I'll claim I'm a genius for wondering about this.
Now, where's my 9/16" drill bit? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif)

Seriously, THANKS so much for this.

[jd74914]

You're welcome.

If you think about it, they don't really have to transfer any load in that direction anyways so it probably doesn't matter how they sit. Erring on the side of caution and having some extra threads stick out doesn't seem like a bad idea though.

These ones I have will be running with a tender spring because I'm not really a fan of having everything move around anyways.

[ChrisFoley]

Yes, open up the hole in the tophat to slide freely on the shock shaft.
IMO there should be a steel washer setting on the step of the shock shaft so the aluminum spacer doesn't take all the load against that narrow lip.
In Stephen's picture it looks like he found a way to utilize a cut-down stock bushing sleeve for that purpose.
In the past I've used the steel washers which are embedded in the oem bump rubbers.

Ultimately you want the tophat as close to the spherical bearing as the assembly will allow - without the tophat ever binding against the base of the shock tower - and at the same time having the shock shaft installed as high as possible without hitting the underside of the deck lid.

[tygaboy]

Thanks Chris Foley. I figured something was in need of a mod.
I have a set of stock shocks and I'll pull them apart to see if maybe I'll go with your steel washer approach.

Thanks to everyone for the help!

Chris

[914forme]

Yes, open up the hole in the tophat to slide freely on the shock shaft.
IMO there should be a steel washer setting on the step of the shock shaft so the aluminum spacer doesn't take all the load against that narrow lip.
In Stephen's picture it looks like he found a way to utilize a cut-down stock bushing sleeve for that purpose.
In the past I've used the steel washers which are embedded in the oem bump rubbers.

Ultimately you want the tophat as close to the spherical bearing as the assembly will allow - without the tophat ever binding against the base of the shock tower - and at the same time having the shock shaft installed as high as possible without hitting the underside of the deck lid.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

The only reason I used a cut down shock top mount was A I had a bunch of them, B I liked the look. C I had just gotten a new toy so it looked like something good to part on my metal lathe. In reality I should have cut it with the horizontal bandsaw, 20 seconds max, instead of hours, assembling the lathe, cleaning it, checking all the tolerances, and then finally using a parting knife and doing these two pieces.

Chris just so you know, my threads would go father up if I could have done it, that is what I needed to use the hats and not bind on the raised pickup.

The stock hat has the clearance built into it all ready. My Colmans have a spacer that fits over the shaft, that is why I have a positive seat. That came with my Bilsteins. My Koni's I don't think have it, but they are currently buried so I would have to dig them out to see.

Here is the clearance the stock hat has.



In my case this is what my hat did.



So I wanted to use the hats I had, like the spring engagement, so I made this spacer to match the distance the stock hat gave me.



Yes the the monoball bushing spacer thingy is oriented in the wrong direction in this picture.

This is the clearance I ended up with, that ball has reached it's limits with out hitting the raised tower.



It is very close but you can still slide past it.

That is why I did what I did, you might have something completely different, only way to know is test it out and see what you get. Since your raised pickups are welded in, I would add something that would leave a mark on contact and pit them through their paces. Make adjustments from there.

I guess I could have also milled a relief in the colmann hat. That would have meant I had to setup the new mill, and a rotary table, etc...

I am now on the hunt for a larger Mill and Lathe. I use the lathe more than I care to admit. Even to the point of making parts, that yes a stack of washers would have built in a fraction of the time.

[ChrisFoley]

Stephen, if you had bored the id of your sleeve for clearance on the shock shaft below the step, you could have extended the shock further without losing the space between tophat and the shock tower.
OTOH, if the shock never bottoms with the existing arrangement, there's no added benefit.

[tygaboy]

Here's my (current) final solution assembly:

- open the hole in the spring hat so if slips over the shaft
- remove the rubber from the stock under hat bumper
- spring goes on
- hat goes on
- custom, no rubber stock "washer" goes on (it has a nice step/recess that perfectly fits on the shaft step!)
- custom spacer goes on (spaces the hat down to prevent it from contacting the underside edge of the Tangerine Racing raised tower)
- Tangerine Racing spacer goes on

This slides up into the shock tower, then the spherical bearing and upper Tangerine Racing spacer go on, then the Al cap and nut

I'm going with helper springs (they arrive tomorrow!) and then this part will be done, de, done DONE! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cheer.gif)

[Cracker]

Chris - Unlike you, I have never called Foley for help...liar, liar, pants on fire!

I'm actually surprised he still answers the phone...from my number! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/drunk.gif)

Tony