Tracking the 914 - Need some street love too..., Turning this into a regular thing... Options

[Justinp71]

Looking good! Good find, it will be interesting to see what a difference that board makes.

Notice any difference in getting full throttle now?

[infraredcalvin]

It’s a bit better, but after my track day I may try to swap boards with the good one on the top plugs only, with nothing on bottom, see if it feels any better. If they truly are working against each other I should be able to tell. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

[infraredcalvin]

A little sidebar, last week I went on a road trip with my best friend. He’s an avid historic racer, and has some really neat cars, one specifically, is near and dear to our hearts… but this story isn’t about that car…

My friend was invited to race at the Velocity Invitational at Laguna Seca (formerly held at Sonoma Raceway - Sears Point). He wanted to get up there early as practice started on Thursday. He chose a good little car that is now becoming one of his favorite road trip cars, a ‘74 Carrera. Nothing fancy, just a nice, driver+ quality car. We set out from the OC (Irvine) at 10 AM in this little dream, headed to Monterey:



The car was about to flip the odometer, we were going to do some photos/postings on the ‘gram when the odo/speedo stopped working a hundred or so miles from flipping back to zero…. Oh well, we had fun anyway…

[Justinp71]

Nice ride! My uncle has a 70 in white that I grew up with, has a strong 2.5L first time I drove that I was shocked at the instant power. We put the first 2.7L in my 914 while I was in high school!

[infraredcalvin]

Very cool story Justin, man you were converting these little cars for a while now! Yes the heavy g body 911 was a little much for the 2.7 installed, but man that has got to be a hoot in a 914… someday I’ll have an RS spec t9 put 8n a 914…

I never posted any pics from the event, here are a couple I finnlyg got to upload on my almost full iPad:









Yes, those are 2 real 250 GTOs, there was a third one there too (white)

[infraredcalvin]

Now for a quick update on my car. Spent some time messing with carbs, a little better here and there, but I think I need a colortune, as I still can’t “hear” the sweet spot. I’m considering a wholesale change, @slivel has a similar motor setup, but very different carb settings. I’m thinking of swapping to what he’s got (I have all the chokes and jets) and seeing what happens…???

I’ve also been playing with timing using my ever trusty 20 year old craftsman adjustable timing light. I was getting erratic readings when taken near coil or near plug. So I used a voltmeter on the electromotive board as suggested in the instructions. I think I got both banks firing at the correct timing. It certainly feels like she woke up a bit on top - although I’m only talking 10-20 hp or so…. Regardless, progress! I also bought another used HPV-1 board and coil in case one of mine is bad.

I’m messing with suspension now. Set up my smart strings and have a combined total of 1/4” toe out in front! That explains why she darts under hard braking, probably also explains why steering feels so heavy. I’ll get her adjusted this weekend, ahhhh I’m sensing the nimbleness of the 914 is about to come back…

Up next I think we”ll also take a look at a poor man’s cornerbalance…

[Van914]

I would like to know what the updated Carb setting are.
Thanks
Van

[BillJ]

1/4" toe out is a bit much. For track car you want no more than an 1/8 " toe out or neutral. Toe in is not generally recommended for track only.

[yeahmag]

Long time listener, first time caller...

Toe out will not cause a heavy feeling in the steering nor darting under breaking. It will cause the car to feel darty on the freeway and turn in FAST. With anything beyond 0mm toe out the car will want to tram line and follow any irregularity in the road. I run about 3mm toe out in the front on 15" wheels with a close ratio rack. It's a pain in the ass on the freeway. Caster on the other hand can make the steering feel heavy. That being said, I run as much caster as I can to help with camber gain while turning.

Darting under braking is likely either an imbalance in the suspension or brake system. Even when I ran 1/4" of toe out on my autocross car you could stand on the brakes without touching the steering wheel and it would stop straight (surface needs to be flat).

[Cracker]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

[infraredcalvin]

@yeahmag & @cracker Thanks for the response guys, I’m a silent listener to both of you on anything you post, you guys have lots of track/course time to the max in these cars.

Fact is yes and yes, my car does track on every single variance on the road, it also turns in fast, if you’ve driven Willow Springs (before the new pavement) you’d understand why it darts under hard braking too. Caster is maxed, as is camber - I forget, but I think I got -1.8 at the front and -2 at the rear.

I’m sure you’ve seen my engine woes above, most of this is venting. Seems like the whole damn car just feels lethargic. I’ve been around 914s enough to know it just doesn’t feel right, and it’s not one thing that’s causing it. It’s got all the right cool kid parts, but it’s like none of them were finely tuned or even tuned at all.

[BillJ]

-2 in the rear with all shims removed? I still have shims on the white car with some still to go. Around -2.2 at present with -1.25 in front. You will dial in what works for you over time.

Been DE and racing 914s for ~32 years.

[infraredcalvin]

Actually I misspoke above, rears measured out at -2, I was advised not to mess with it until some of thes other issues were resolved with the fronts.

Actually, I just reread above, and it clicked this time, lots of caster makes steering heavy… hmmmm, you just made something else click…. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

I gotta check something else on my front suspension this weekend…

[Justinp71]

Nice pics!

I did some winter tuning on my motor, it really likes to be rich at idle. Damn it pulls hard from 4-7k rpms (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)... and my daily has 400hp so.

You should get there, keep checking... Maybe you do have some sort of ignition problem. Carbs like quick advance timing, that woke my motor up when I first built it. Did you get your WOT afr's in the high 12's yet?

[infraredcalvin]

Yes, I wish there was a better way to check ignition. The board seems to show steady (when hooked up to multimeter) but am I getting the same at plug? I have experienced and have read several other threads suggest that timing lights have been unreliable at best - even the expensive ones.

I think I’ll try to hook the board up to my data logger, so I can at least see what it’s doing at what rpm when under load.

I did find a Porsche Indy (actually a race shop) in Whittier that has lots of experience with -6s, (carb tuning) and also has a dynojet at the shop. We chatted extensively, and looked at my dyno sheets and logs. I got some good suggestions for data gathering before spending $$$ on dyno. I won’t be able to get my car over to him till after the holidays…. When I stumbled upon his shop he was working on Vivian Campbell's (Def Leppard/Dio) IROC/RSR 911 tribute.

Still running rich at WOT, but I noticed the other day (ran car to the office) that I was running really lean (15s) at partial throttle uphill (about 4K rpm). Sometimes I think that afr gauge is a curse, being able to glance at it during a drive.

[infraredcalvin]

Good day today at the shop. Last drive last week I felt a single shutter in the front suspension, felt it once on the track too, couldn’t really put my finger on it except that it felt like the suspension was moving, yet I couldn’t see any evidence (I thought it was the shock mount at the top). Then while discussing caster above it dawned on me where the movement was occurring.

I set my front toe to 0 deg and took it for a drive today. Found that when I hit my brakes hard while in reverse, I’d get the shutter, then again if I hit the brakes hard moving forward. Back on the lift, sure enough, the a arms were sliding front to back. The PO had put on the infamous needle bearings, but appeared that the front mount was not pushed all the way back to prevent movement when tightened. Also found one of the front outer bearing mounts was backwards - I flipped it, took a clamp to the assembly and tightened all up. Put my strings back up and readjusted toe.

Hopefully there wasn’t a reason the mount was on backwards (like the needle bearings were installed backwards on this mount by accident….???

Gave me an opportunity to take the turbo out for a spin too:

[infraredcalvin]

Happy NYE all, had my car at the house for the holidays, didn’t mess with it much. Except as I was chasing down sloppy throttle and clutch linkage, it revealed almost non existent pedal cluster bushings. Car came with a new set so this must’ve been on the POs list. I didn’t do a restore, just cleaned things up and put her all back in the car. Just need to put the cable back on trans side and put skid plate back under steering rack. This is so much easier on a lift….

[Justinp71]

Happy new year! Cool to see your still progressing. I installed a sport muffler over the holidays similar to what you have. Trying to tone down the start/idle sound and droning. Ended up be louder than the magnaflow (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif). Also has probably ~25hp less or so, takes about another 1/2 second to get to 6k rpms in 3rd gear than before. I haven't found anything that beats the magnaflow in performance which aligns to the Knight racing recommendation on it.

[BillJ]

Have enjoyed watching your progression with the car! Have been totally reworking my 6 too and just test fitted new seat tonight as well as new dash a buddy is starting to fab for me.

[infraredcalvin]

Track day Friday, the 28th, looking forward to that. I may pull my muffler and see what happens. @Justinp71 what brand muffler did you get? Also, do you mind sharing your carb settings? I’m going to try some drastic changes just to see what they do. I bought a colortune for the initial carb setting, all took minor adjustments but found a few really rich (confirmed by plugs too). Got much better throttle response, so feeling more comfortable making changes. Also bought a hardwired datalogger so I can log a bit easier, the handheld one I have is glitchy, and would only log one bank, I want to see how both are performing together.

@BillJ your car looks great, I’ve still been struggling with livery, I like the look for the track, but I still run my car on the street. A big meatball and number is a little flashy… thinking of going back to ghost graphics (matte black over gloss black paint). Check your headroom with that seat mount. I got a little claustrophobic with a helmet on, but I also have a diagonal at the halo, so with padding my helmet would brush against it - I didn’t like that feeling. I ended up making an adaptor for the seat mount that allowed me to mount the set a bit lower than the tilted rails. It gave me that extra inch to feel comfortable, BTW I’m not tall, 5’8” (short legs, long torso). Still have to mess with the shifter, I have to lean forward to get into 1-3-5, so either need to bend and or extend the shifter.