1975 Door DOT/VIN Sticker - Was CA different? Options

[DaveB]

i'm going with the idea that all the best colors had black stickers.

a bit like howling wolf versus frank sinatra.

my sticker is black.

BTW - Are there any examples of the sticker you posted in silver? I'm wondering if they were all black. Or silver is the new black. I only go back as far as Netflix.

DaveB

[wonkipop]

i'm going with the idea that all the best colors had black stickers.

a bit like howling wolf versus frank sinatra.

my sticker is black.

BTW - Are there any examples of the sticker you posted in silver? I'm wondering if they were all black. Or silver is the new black. I only go back as far as Netflix.

DaveB

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
i'll go back through my files and see if there is a sliver one in what i found.
the text layout will be the same as the one on your car or the one i posted.
you have got an original sticker on yours already - no worries.
they just changed the color of the background for whatever reason depending on the car color or whatever the theory is.
they must have done the new sticker layout sometime in late jan 75.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[StarBear]

Wasn’t planning on jumping into this thread until I saw that both @StarBear and @drem914 have a silver tag while I have a black tag one month after starbear and 13mo before drem!

I used to think the silver or dark was a date thing, but now I wonder if you got a light or dark tag based on the color of your car?!

i'm going with the idea that all the best colors had black stickers.

a bit like howling wolf versus frank sinatra.

my sticker is black.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/KMA.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

Hehehehe. A riot.
It’s my understanding, from Mr. B if I recall, that in general silver used on dark colors and black on light colors. But not always, apparently……

[Van B]

Wasn’t planning on jumping into this thread until I saw that both @StarBear and @drem914 have a silver tag while I have a black tag one month after starbear and 13mo before drem!

I used to think the silver or dark was a date thing, but now I wonder if you got a light or dark tag based on the color of your car?!

i'm going with the idea that all the best colors had black stickers.

a bit like howling wolf versus frank sinatra.

my sticker is black.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/KMA.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

Hehehehe. A riot.
It’s my understanding, from Mr. B if I recall, that in general silver used on dark colors and black on light colors. But not always, apparently……

Given the punch dot style, it had to be based on best contrast so the sticker can be read. What I wonder though is whether it was truly determined in a German fashion or if some Italian kid was working the VIN sticker station and picked the silver or black based on his own interpretation lol… (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

[drem914]

thanks mate.

no rush, when you get time.
sounds like your car has a bit more punch these days.
......and it came from chicago. love chicago.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)


Thanks, yes it does now go up the hill with a bit more vigor. Don't know how it got from Chicago to San Francisco and finally down to Orange County, in the 10 years in between, but would like to.
I tried contacting the orig. owner, with George Hussey's help from his database, but never got a call back after a couple of voice mails left. Still looking for an original Porsche at O'hare license plate frame, if there are any out there.

[wonkipop]

@DaveB

found a silver one in my files for you.
right time period, right text.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[wonkipop]

Wasn’t planning on jumping into this thread until I saw that both @StarBear and @drem914 have a silver tag while I have a black tag one month after starbear and 13mo before drem!

I used to think the silver or dark was a date thing, but now I wonder if you got a light or dark tag based on the color of your car?!

i'm going with the idea that all the best colors had black stickers.

a bit like howling wolf versus frank sinatra.

my sticker is black.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/KMA.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

Hehehehe. A riot.
It’s my understanding, from Mr. B if I recall, that in general silver used on dark colors and black on light colors. But not always, apparently……

Given the punch dot style, it had to be based on best contrast so the sticker can be read. What I wonder though is whether it was truly determined in a German fashion or if some Italian kid was working the VIN sticker station and picked the silver or black based on his own interpretation lol… (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

i can't disagree with that.

same color.

this one the italian sticker kid did?




he got poached by ferrari.

and the turkish kid got his job.



looks like he was on the beers and got laid the night before.

[Van B]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif)
Those two cars show that there is truly a limit to German quality control!

Someone gave negative zero shits on that second car! It’s so “Wonki” you know it has to be the real deal (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bootyshake.gif)

[burton73]

My 76 mostly original paint car I sold to Dax in begum that was a CA car shows the vin sticker and the misaligned silver Smog sticker for CA

Sorry that the picture is not that good but there you have it.

Bob B

[JeffBowlsby]

I bet if someone wanted to, they could make list of paint colors for each year, and the pattern of either silver or black labels assigned to each specific chassis color would become evident. Two different shades of red do not establish a pattern.

[wonkipop]

I bet if someone wanted to, they could make list of paint colors for each year, and the pattern of either silver or black labels assigned to each specific chassis color would become evident. Two different shades of red do not establish a pattern.

those two 75s i put up are the same shade of red.
one is black and one is silver sticker.

see the post before for DaveB with 75 silver sicker.
see the post below with the other 75.

the 76 is a different red i believe with its cat sticker.
but the other two are the same.

i've seen a couple of other examples where both stickers are used on the one color.
i'm pretty sure i have come across a phoenix red 74 with a silver sticker, but my phoenix red has a black sticker.

silver would not work so good on white.
i think it was not necessarily hard and fast with some of the colors and they could use both stickers.

i also have a feeling that scrambling sticker colors kind of lends itself as well to security anti tampering measures. the factory might have had a log? does anyone know how it was intended that these stickers worked as a security feature - in terms of US law that is - and what other car makers did. where these a kind of universal sticker or are they particular to VW. there was nothing like them here in australia.

[davep]

I have about 165 of the 914/4 DOT compliance decals, and have found 5 varieties in two colors (Black & Silver) each. Type 4 is quite rare, and was used for perhaps just 5 weeks in Jan 1975 and the early part of February. There are several errors known, some more spectacular than others. They were used in the USA and Canada, with Canada getting a small additional label. The CAT and NON-CAT decals were only seen in 1976 model year. Here are the 5 types:

[wonkipop]

couldn't wait, went off and searched out answer to my own question.


USA is fantastic.
all this stuff back in time is retrievable directly from govt. archives on line.

NHTSA section 567.
came into effect 1969.

for all you guys,
your legal vin plate is the sticker in the door jamb.
not the plate in the front trunk or anything else.
its the door sticker the feds recognize and mandate.

the stamped plate in the front was an unregulated plate (in the eyes of the USA Fed authorities) that many manufacturers had been doing off their own bat for decades before. used by registration authorities in other countries, like europe or australia, or even the individual states of the USA prior to 1969 to identify the vehicle but not regulated by the law or an act of parliament/congress etc in those countries.

now i get it.

all manufacturers in the USA and importing manufacturers conformed to this label law after 1969 for the USA by either riveting a plate in the door or doing what porsche and VW with a tamper proof label in the door. the NHTSA act specified you could do one or the other.

everything printed on the label is word for word mandated by NHTSA 567.

and the letters have to be in contrast to the background.

so -----> there would have been a little bit of leeway for some porsche colors with their stamped labels in terms of contrast and not with others i suspect.
so you could probably get away with a silver or black label on some cars and do either, but not others. possibly why its not hard and fast with certain cars as to what color label.

heres the act in original form.




moral of the story.
technically under federal law you should not be tampering with that label.
because thats the VIN plate in america. the one and only.
and if you do, you were supposed to order a replacement through a registered company with authority to make a replacement. via the dealer.

[wonkipop]

above is interesting in relation to a BAT car that @Jett pointed out in another thread.

technically that car is incorrectly titled?
the vin in that case under fed law is the Vin sticker.

but i'm not a lawyer or a registration authority.

[wonkipop]

I have about 165 of the 914/4 DOT compliance decals, and have found 5 varieties in two colors (Black & Silver) each. Type 4 is quite rare, and was used for perhaps just 5 weeks in Jan 1975 and the early part of February. There are several errors known, some more spectacular than others. They were used in the USA and Canada, with Canada getting a small additional label. The CAT and NON-CAT decals were only seen in 1976 model year. Here are the 5 types:

so DaveB's original usa vin plate/label is a rare one.
doesn't have germany written on it when VAG was on the top line.
fascinating. lesson - never assume anything?
didn't spot that and thought it had worn off his sticker or was lost in reflections/overspray.
never seen that particular one without germany on it.
thanks for visual run down of all the types.

history.
always tells a story, what the story is often hard to say.
but ......there will be a reason even if trivial.
in this case i'm guessing the feds stepped in around early 75 and said you had to include country of manufacture origin or location of company hq.

there is a bit of a blurb around importers in the original act.
and them having to be on stickers.
which they are not on most of the VW or 914 vin stickers.
the importer would have been VW North America?
a kind of subsidiary of Volkswagen.
they must have got tackled on that?

[JeffBowlsby]

As I recall Porsche reassumed a controlling interest in the 914 in late 1974, so I wonder if the change in labeling was related to that?

[StarBear]

As I recall Porsche reassumed a controlling interest in the 914 in late 1974, so I wonder if the change in labeling was related to that?

You’re the MAN, Jeff! Thanks for all you do around here! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/first.gif)

[JeffBowlsby]

Late 74 is also the moment in time that the front trunk chassis plates replacing the rear trunk stamped numbers, and the plastic fuel expansion tanks showed up.

[wonkipop]

As I recall Porsche reassumed a controlling interest in the 914 in late 1974, so I wonder if the change in labeling was related to that?

labels seem to change across entire VW range, consistent with 914s.
its a VAG thing?

VWs get germany on the label like 14s.
later germany changes to west germany, have seen that on 79 beetle label.



also - whatever is on the vin label is mandated by USA feds.
you couldn't make up any or add extra words.
even specified exact ht of letters.

if they had to add in germany, the feds told them to do it.
germany versus west germany thing is interesting.
that would be unrelated to VW - something to do with germany's official name in international law/relations. i read about that once somewhere but can't remember exactly how it all went in terms of official names for east and west germany in cold war era.

i'm guessing if you searched hard enough you would come across VW fed vin labels exactly matching all the different types of 914 labels that davep has listed above.
including the rare one he points out. probably for approx same time period.

also 911 labels of same era. probably germany appears right about the same time.
VW north america were handling the import of 911s into the USA and distribution?

[wonkipop]

Late 74 is also the moment in time that the front trunk chassis plates replacing the rear trunk stamped numbers, and the plastic fuel expansion tanks showed up.

thats interesting too.
front trunk riveted plate replacing stamped trunk numbers is karmann adopting VW practice. VW had been putting the body/production number on that small riveted plate across its entire range since 1970 (except for 914s). even karmann built beetle convertibles and ghias had the rivetted plate since 1970.

you are right that when it changes in 74 its because porsche now controlled the marketing. but i think its in a back to front way. the car was finally recognized as pure VW manufacture. ie no more 914/6s or shared platform across two distinct car companies. which could have been why the riveted plate had been left off since 1970. porsche did not want that recognizable vw plate on its 914/6s? instead wanted the fancy karmann plate which some earlier karmann built 911 bodies had. and back when vw and porsche started the project i think they all assumed the 6 would be a lot more successful than it ended up being. it would have been an early protocol. its a wonder they did not bring the riveted plates in for 73.

EDIT
ps
i did find something about that riveted plate on other VWs when i was looking for those wacky numbered 75 914 karmann plates that @MCShack had spotted.

its got to do with how VW were making their mainstay cars. beetles, buses and type 3s.
those cars had floor pans and separate bodies. i think the floor pans had their own production number as did the bodies. VW introduced a protocol that meant when the two came together halfway down the production line already highly assembled as distinct halves of the car, the whole thing received the production plate at that moment and it was riveted on. easier to do on the moving production? dunno. i'm not sure how true that account was. its kind of not so relevant to uni body cars like the ghias, or 412s or 914s. or even sciroccos. but they introduced it and did it across their range. the 914 was the last car to go over to it.