Keys by code Options

[TheCabinetmaker]

914 locks. com is now making keys by code

If you don't have the code, l can make a key by the wafer sequence

Price is $65.00 and includes a black oem key.

Extra cut keys (including red valet keys) are available at $45.00 each.

Generic cut keys are $15.00 each.

Blank oem keys are $30.00 each

Contact me at cbntmkr at (@) gmail.com for more info.

[dr914@autoatlanta.com]

excellent offering and price

914 locks. com is now making keys by code

If you don't have the code, l can make a key by the wafer sequence

Price is $65.00 and includes a black oem key.

Extra cut keys (including red valet keys) are available at $45.00 each.

Generic cut keys are $15.00 each.

Blank oem keys are $30.00 each

Contact me at cbntmkr at (@) gmail.com for more info.

[arbitrary]

Curious what the format of a key code is and how that translates to the wafer sequence if you’re able to share?

[FlacaProductions]

Just got a key cut by Curt using my code - works perfectly unlike the keys I had which came with the car when I got it 3 years ago.

[TheCabinetmaker]

Curious what the format of a key code is and how that translates to the wafer sequence if you’re able to share?

It's not a secret. The 4 digit code doesn't really relate to the wafer size and location. The code is just a number you look up in a chart that gives the info on the key with the locations of the cut, and the wafer size for that cut. The# on the wafer gives the depth of the cut.

[lesorubcheek]

Curious what the format of a key code is and how that translates to the wafer sequence if you’re able to share?

It's not a secret. The 4 digit code doesn't really relate to the wafer size and location. The code is just a number you look up in a chart that gives the info on the key with the locations of the cut, and the wafer size for that cut. The# on the wafer gives the depth of the cut.

Thanks for the info Curt. Like @arbitrary , I too have been very curious how the key codes map to wafer sequence. Always hoped it was some math puzzle and a fun challenge to find the solution. Read multiple sites referring to the chart, but that's where information ends.

I don't want to sidetrack your thread, so if you think this doesn't belong here, I'll gladly delete, but wanted to share the following. Much of this I'm sure is obvious and repetitive to many, but maybe it can help a person new to keys. My hands-on data is limited to 3 vehicles and for none of them do I their key code, only wafer sequences, and info found online.

- There are 4 different wafer sizes (5 counting the valet)
- 10 wafers (5 on each side of a cylinder) are used on each lock cylinder
- There are 4^10 or 1,048,576 possible wafer combinations
- Key codes only appear to contain 4 numeric digits for 10,000 possible codes. Not 100% sure of this, but findings elude to this conclusion. Some codes even appear to be only 2 or 3 digits, but can only assume leading zeroes in these cases
- Even if key codes were hexadecimal, they would require 5 hex digits for all possible wafer combinations. FFFFFx = 1,048,576
- The valet wafer is a replacement for a #2 wafer that's halfway stepped for essentially 2 different possible depths. A slot in black keys allows proper wafer depth on a valet wafer at a #2 wafer position, but red (valet) keys have a different slot offset that doesn't allow proper depth. The valet key would have the proper wafer depth on a normal # 2 wafer, but not on a valet wafer at the same position
- For the valet idea to work, all locks must contain at least one #2 wafer and corresponding valet wafer on the appropriate lock cylinders. This limits the actual number of possible wafer combinations to less than 4^10. It hurts the brain too much to try to remember all the combination/permutation math, but it'd be 3 (#1, #3, or #4) possible wafers in 9 of ten possible positions with a #2 in the remainder.
- Of the 3 vehicles we own and I've examined, 4 of the 10 wafers on all are #2. Non-door and non-ignition locks unsurprisingly contained 4 corresponding valet wafers in those #2 positions. It makes sense that multiple valet wafers are used to help spread mechanical force if attempting to open a glove compartment or trunk with a valet key. Can't say for all cases, but speculation is at least 2, maybe 3, possibly even 4 is the minimum number of #2 wafers (and corresponding valet wafers) used on all cars. Again, only speculation. If this is true, the possible number of different wafer sequences drops significantly and a 4 digit key code for all possible keys starts to make more sense
- The big question I still have; Are there valid wafer sequences (including proper valet wafers interspersed) that would not have a mapped key code in the chart? I won't lose sleep over it, but it's one of those mysteries in life that would be very satisfying to learn the answer.

Dan

[TheCabinetmaker]

Dan, if I understand your question correctly, I'm saying no. What really matters is the fact that only using a 4 digit code, there are only10,000 different codes. With only about 116,000 cars made, there could be 12 cars worldwide with the same key as yours. )The key in my 55 Chevy fit perfectly in my Dad's 56 Buick).

[lesorubcheek]

Dan, if I understand your question correctly, I'm saying no. What really matters is the fact that only using a 4 digit code, there are only10,000 different codes. With only about 116,000 cars made, there could be 12 cars worldwide with the same key as yours. )The key in my 55 Chevy fit perfectly in my Dad's 56 Buick).

That makes good sense Curt. I'll try to clarify what I meant. Let's say I'm a big Rush fan, so I wanted a key made with a wafer sequence of 2112211221. Could I be sure there is a 4 digit key code that matched that wafer sequence? Maybe someone really enjoyed their 14th birthday, so they want a key sequence of 1421421414. It just seems that even with the requirement of a certain number of #2s in the mix there would still be more than 10,000 combinations of wafers possible. It's just the ocd engineering nerd part of my brain that worries about this, so no loss if the answer remains unknown.

Don't think I said it earlier, but want to thank you for the service you're offering making the keys. Again, I don't want to clutter your post, just seemed like a good place to talk about this, but have no problems deleting if you'd prefer.

Dan

[ChrisFoley]

It doesn't matter if Porsche never established a key code for a particular wafer sequence. The key cutter can be programmed for, and the locks can be altered to match, any wafer sequence.

[mlindner]

Curt, I only have one key (black one). Need another made. where is the key code, or do I need to just send you the key. Thanks, Mark

[TheCabinetmaker]

Dan, there are indeed more than 10,000 combinations of wafer positions, but only 10,000 4 digit codes.

Chris is totally correct. Any combination of wafer location can be programmed and a key cut for that combination. Even if cutting the key by hand. The code is just a path to the lock and key information. Like a link to a webpage or the location of a library book.

[bbrock]

If you have a door or ignition tumbler out, you can get your code by reading the wafer numbers from shoulder to tip. The numbers are stamped on the wafers. There is a great technical article on re-keying locks here. And here is a thread discussing reading the code. It worked for me.

The reason you can't use trunk or glove box keys to get the code is because they will have a valet wafer randomly placed somewhere in the cylinder which will leave you with a missing digit on your code.

BTW, Curt's service is a screaming deal compared to what I spent buying genuine key blanks from Porsche and having a local locksmith cut them by code.

[TheCabinetmaker]

Curt, I only have one key (black one). Need another made. where is the key code, or do I need to just send you the key. Thanks, Mark

Email me, Mark. Cbntmkr at gmail. com

[TheCabinetmaker]

If you have a door or ignition tumbler out, you can get your code by reading the wafer numbers from shoulder to tip. The numbers are stamped on the wafers. There is a great technical article on re-keying locks here. And here is a thread discussing reading the code. It worked for me.

The reason you can't use trunk or glove box keys to get the code is because they will have a valet wafer randomly placed somewhere in the cylinder which will leave you with a missing digit on your code.

BTW, Curt's service is a screaming deal compared to what I spent buying genuine key blanks from Porsche and having a local locksmith cut them by code.

The valet wafer replaces the # 2 wafer, so the code can be found that way. Not all wafers are stamped. I measure every wafer to make sure it's in tolerance with factory wafer sizes.

[lesorubcheek]

If you have a door or ignition tumbler out, you can get your code by reading the wafer numbers from shoulder to tip.

With a tumbler out and reading the wafer sequence, yes you can obtain the wafer sequence, and yes, Curt can then make a key, no problemo. (Thank you Curt!) However, an average person cannot obtain the 4 digit key code by examining the wafers. One needs access to the chart which maps the key codes to the wafer sequence. Yes, Curt has the chart, but that's not public knowledge.

The key code is supposedly stamped on the drivers side door mechanism on 914s. This doesn't help however if the original has been discarded since it broke many years ago and was replaced, having that odd key. On 911s, the code is on a small stamp glued to the ignition switch. This doesn't help if said stamp has been removed. The code was originally on a card that was attached to the valet keys. Again, if you have the card, great, but if not, oh well.

The point is, for completeness, it's good to know the key code. For a long time the 4 digit code was the standard means of going to a dealer and obtaining a duplicate key. Yes, today Curt can provide keys with any wafer sequence so knowing the 4 digit key code isn't necessary. You can even come up with a custom wafer sequence and you can have a key made that works perfectly. It seems however that some custom sequences may not have a corresponding key code in the chart. Yes, you'll have keys and all is fine, but if you lose your keys and need a replacement, you won't be able to use the 4 digit code and conveniently get a replacement.

Dan

[bbrock]

If you have a door or ignition tumbler out, you can get your code by reading the wafer numbers from shoulder to tip.

With a tumbler out and reading the wafer sequence, yes you can obtain the wafer sequence, and yes, Curt can then make a key, no problemo. (Thank you Curt!) However, an average person cannot obtain the 4 digit key code by examining the wafers. One needs access to the chart which maps the key codes to the wafer sequence. Yes, Curt has the chart, but that's not public knowledge.

The key code is supposedly stamped on the drivers side door mechanism on 914s. This doesn't help however if the original has been discarded since it broke many years ago and was replaced, having that odd key. On 911s, the code is on a small stamp glued to the ignition switch. This doesn't help if said stamp has been removed. The code was originally on a card that was attached to the valet keys. Again, if you have the card, great, but if not, oh well.

The point is, for completeness, it's good to know the key code. For a long time the 4 digit code was the standard means of going to a dealer and obtaining a duplicate key. Yes, today Curt can provide keys with any wafer sequence so knowing the 4 digit key code isn't necessary. You can even come up with a custom wafer sequence and you can have a key made that works perfectly. It seems however that some custom sequences may not have a corresponding key code in the chart. Yes, you'll have keys and all is fine, but if you lose your keys and need a replacement, you won't be able to use the 4 digit code and conveniently get a replacement.

Dan

I'm learning (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif) So if I understand correctly, reading the wafer sequence as I posted gives you a 10-digit code that can be used to cut a key, but is not "THE key code" which is 4-digit. Can the 4-digit code be looked up in reverse from the 10-digit wafer sequence (understanding that some custom sequences might not back reference to a code)?

I also didn't know the valet wafer replaces a #2. When I re-keyed my locks, I just used it as kind of a wildcard to replace a wafer I was short on. Must have gotten lucky since they all work.

[TheCabinetmaker]

@bbrock yes.

[mlindner]

Well Curt has really done it....Keys by code, how about Keys by picture. I only have one key, told Curt I would send it to him this fall after Wisconsin driving weather to have two duplicates made. He said, why don't you send me a good picture and I'll see what I can do. Results, BRAND NEW key that works as good as the 45 year old original. That is really neat Curt. What a service to our little 914world community. Thanks, Mark

[ChrisFoley]

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[TheCabinetmaker]

Thank you Brian, you were a pleasure to work with.

An old dog "can" still learn new tricks!