rush to red rocks classic, How not to prepare for an event Options

[targa72e]

So, jump forward. My 914 -6 conversion now has its 4th motor and can move under its own power. Planning on driving from Denver to Salt lake for RRC.

About 5 years ago I decided to jump into the 914 world. I have several 911 engines needing projects and roller 911's have become really expensive ( and I have two 911 rollers that are already planed projects) so I bought a 914 for a -6 conversion. Not knowing much at the time I got lucky with pretty rust free 73.
It has kind of become my engine mule. First engine was a 2.4 MFI motor with S pistons and Ecams. Used it to decide if I like 914's, I do.

Mule as it looks now.



Ended up selling that motor to another 914 world member in Florida.

My friend (who will be joining me at Red Rocks, also shares the same name) also had engines that needed to be built.
So with the engine bay empty we built a 2.7 RS+ engine with RS pistons and Mod S cams and weber carbs. This was a big step up. Dyno below of 2.4 E with S cams vs 2.7 RS+.



We are working to get his 76 911 travel capable but if he is too soft for no AC he will bring his 01 turbo (you can give him crap).

His 2.7 made my 914 much more fun. I had a 2.7 engine in planning for "my 914" that this helped solidify the specs.

Since I jumped into the 914 world I started looking for "my 914" project to build how I wanted based on my experience so far. This resulted in having 4 914's at one point.

One of the cars I purchased sent me down a side road. It was originally a sad neglected car with great potential. I purchased it thinking it would make a great start for "my 914-6" but was ultimately too nice for me to modify so I spent a year and a half bringing it back to good health. It was purchased by another 914 member and should be at RRC as well. Story hear.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...mp;hl=white+car

So after my friends engine vacated my cars engine bay I decided to build what I called my "junk yard dog" motor. This was built from parts I had that had no home. While not in new spec they were not yet worn out. They consisted of a 2.4 case that I used my new mill to add case savers and deck ( it was quite warped in this area). It was built to similar spec to the first engine, 2.4 with JE pistons 9.5 to 1 and E cams. It had T heads ported to S specs and ran Zenith TIN carbs instead of MFI from first engine. Made great power with the larger ports and a little more compression compared to stock port size MFI engine I originally built.



So ended up purchasing a bunch of 914 and 911 parts early this winter. This included a mostly ready to build motor plus a spare 2.7. About the same time I saw a post from some one with a 912 that wanted a complete 911 motor. Why not sell the "junk yard dog", I had a good 6 months until RRC why not make my 914 immobile again (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I would have plenty of time to build another engine.

Too be continued

John

See you at RRC one way or another.

[gereed75]

Looks like an interesting thread and story. Quite a lot of early 911 engine experience also
And some nice data

Being a dyojet i assume those are WHP numbers vice crank HP??

[Montreal914]

Beautiful car! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[targa72e]

Too continue. Parts purchase included two 911 engines. One was a 2.7 that had a small fire but was pretty complete and the other was a 2.4 the original parts owner was planning to use to build for a 914-6 conversion. They ended up not doing the -6 conversion and installing a Subaru motor instead.
So the 2.4 motor parts included a 2.4 case with all the machine work done. line hone, decking, oil bypass, inserts and shuffle pin.



Also came with a set of 2.4 heads that were rebuilt and twin plugged (along with valve covers). I set the heads aside to use on my future twin plug 2.7 for my other 914-6 conversion.



Also included new nikasil 86mm cylinders and JE pistons. So building a 2.5 long stroke. Came with good SC oil pump and all the engine tin.
I sent the crank from the 2.7 out for Mag and polish. Then I started trying to source some parts. I decided to use a set of 2.4 CIS T heads I had and planned to port them like my previous motor as they made good power. Started checking with the Porsche machine shops and most were 6 to 9 months out for work. I had to change plans to meet time deadline and decided to do some of the work my self and use local machine shop for rest.

Had difficulty sourcing vale guides do to supply chain issues. Same with bushings for rods. Time was slipping away with delays in getting parts.
I was able to source NOS bushings of ebay from someone who had a stash. Finally found valve guides. Sourced AA rod bearings from local parts distributor and rockers and Wrightwood gasket set from Supertec. Things were coming together. Build plan: 2.5L with single plug and 9.5 to 1. heads ported to S spec, MOD s cams, rebuilt Zenith carbs on PMO manifolds. Heads and rods went to local machine shop at end of May. Pistons would need to be machined for 9.5 compression as originally 10.5. It was starting to Looking like it might happen.

too be continued...

[rgalla9146]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Keep it coming. Great engine thread.
Wish I was going to Red Rocks.

[targa72e]

Some more details.
AA bearings are quire nice. They have measured out good and are coated. Have used these on last several builds do to poor quality of Glyco rod bearings.



Had a set of NOS mains that I used. Glyco intermediate bearings.

Case was done was was mostly cleaned but was having issues with a couple squirters. Ended up making a tool on lathe to help me blow out the squirters .



In the end I won and all the squirters opened and had good spray.

Finally got the rods back from machine shop at the end of July. I had Rockers, Chains and Wrightwood gasket set from Supertec. Planned a 4 day weekend and I got the Bottom end assembled while waiting for heads. Got head studs set at correct height and started checking deck height.



Needed to verify piston CC volume. My set up.



I got the heads back the end of July. Planned another 4 day weekend to get them machined final cleaning and assembly. I had previously made a fixture out of a old cam tower to machine heads on my lathe. I had done some core heads as a test and they turned out perfect so I was ready to machine. My set up.



too be continued...

[Superhawk996]

I got the heads back the end of July. Planned another 4 day weekend to get them machined final cleaning and assembly. I had previously made a fixture out of a old cam tower to machine heads on my lathe. I had done some core heads as a test and they turned out perfect so I was ready to machine. My set up.



too be continued...

Would love to see more photos and detail on the fixture you made out of the cam tower.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/pray.gif)

I have a 2.4L conversion planned but at the moment cross country relocation and lack of a garage has out all my 914 work on a temporary hold. Will be watching this one for inspiration!

[targa72e]

So I was pretty happy with fixture and head machining. Basically zero run out. video link below.

https://youtube.com/shorts/WxHmpErr5Rk

Now I could cc the heads to calculate compression ratio. I had to machine the pistons to hit my target ratio of 9.8 to 1. All was looking good to assemble top end. I measured and grouped cylinders and cylinder heads side to side to minimize variability and ended up well under Porsche spec.

While I was measuring for cam timing and lift I noticed quite a difference from one side to the other. I ended up checking rocker ratio by looking at max lift. I knew there would be some variability.



I put the highest lift on the intake side and lowest on exhaust. I figured exhaust is being expelled under pressure. In the end we are only looking at .15mm difference from most lift to least.
Cams timed, chains set for parallelism, all rockers adjusted for clearance. etc. I rebuilt a set of 930 tensioners and installed locks this took some time but finally I have a long block on August 8th. It was a really long 4 day weekend.



now only had to do all the other stuff. Just over a month to go. I wanted to get the engine on my test stand and run it before install but did not have the bock off for left side. Looked at several options available for purchase and built my own, happy with how it turned out.



final wiring and hookup. Still had to put carbs back together. Carb reassembly took longer than expected. O-rings in rebuild kit for idle adjusters were to big. Zeniths put back together with 34mm Venturi and 145 main jets based off previous experience with 2.4 and E cams. Found I was missing a couple fuel inlets for carbs but was able to order next day. Also found out my manifolds that were sold as 40 x 36 are actually 46 x 36, they will have to do for now why I try and source the correct size. getting final stuff done, quickest way to find firing order ended up being taking picture of shirt I have.



Got the engine mounted up on my home made test stand to test run. Much easier to fix at this stage if there are issue without having to try and work in 914 engine bay or pull engine again to fix. Very rough settings for carbs and timing to get engine to run. Final adjustments will be with engine in the car.
August 21st and Its alive. Just over 3 weeks until plan to leave for red rocks. video link below.

https://youtube.com/shorts/1OqRMeo87H4

No leaks or issues so short run on stand. Time to get engine installed in car.

john

[targa72e]

Ran the engine on stand a few more times during the week to make sure there were no issues. Tried to do a little carb tuning with out much success. August 27th engine goes in car. Now I can drive a little and do final tune on carbs (so I think). Engine runs ok but I still have the idle turned up to about 1600rpm. If the car idles for more than about 30-40 seconds idle drops and is stalls. Not sure whats going on at this point.

Driving around more to try and get some miles on new engine. Still cant get carbs to work correctly. These were carbs I purchased that the previous owner who could not get to run correctly. When I took them apart on of the screws for the float pivot was in the bottom of the bowl, no wonder they would not work correctly, that was the issue I thought. That was not the only problem.
Trying to get my wide band O2 working and had some driver issues to PC. Had ignition on with fuel pump running for a while during trouble shooting and started to smell gas. Quick check and one of the needle valves on one carb is not sealing correctly and bowls are over flowing into two cylinders. ah ha moment as to why the car ran OK but died after 30+ seconds of idling.

Luckily i had several other valves to try. Swapped good valve to overflowing end of carb to make sure that was the issue (it was). one problem fixed. Car now idled better and did not die after 30-40 seconds.

Started back at basics with checking float bowl fuel height and starting carb tuning over from scratch. Another problem found. Turns out the float level on the one carbs was set at Weber height which is quite a bit higher than Zeniths. Another problem fixed. More adjusting and tuning (I hate carbs) runs much better but still can not get idle below about 1400 before engine just dies.

Started back at square one double checking ignition timing. Total advance looked good but it looked like advance was coming in to fast. Distributor came out of running car so assumed it was in good order. Pulled it apart and found the advance springs had been messed with and were not working correctly. Pulled spare distributor apart and made one good one. Another weekend done and another problem fixed....

[ClayPerrine]

Ran the engine on stand a few more times during the week to make sure there were no issues. Tried to do a little carb tuning with out much success. August 27th engine goes in car. Now I can drive a little and do final tune on carbs (so I think). Engine runs ok but I still have the idle turned up to about 1600rpm. If the car idles for more than about 30-40 seconds idle drops and is stalls. Not sure whats going on at this point.

Driving around more to try and get some miles on new engine. Still cant get carbs to work correctly. These were carbs I purchased that the previous owner who could not get to run correctly. When I took them apart on of the screws for the float pivot was in the bottom of the bowl, no wonder they would not work correctly, that was the issue I thought. That was not the only problem.
Trying to get my wide band O2 working and had some driver issues to PC. Had ignition on with fuel pump running for a while during trouble shooting and started to smell gas. Quick check and one of the needle valves on one carb is not sealing correctly and bowls are over flowing into two cylinders. ah ha moment as to why the car ran OK but died after 30+ seconds of idling.

Luckily i had several other valves to try. Swapped good valve to overflowing end of carb to make sure that was the issue (it was). one problem fixed. Car now idled better and did not die after 30-40 seconds.

Started back at basics with checking float bowl fuel height and starting carb tuning over from scratch. Another problem found. Turns out the float level on the one carbs was set at Weber height which is quite a bit higher than Zeniths. Another problem fixed. More adjusting and tuning (I hate carbs) runs much better but still can not get idle below about 1400 before engine just dies.

Started back at square one double checking ignition timing. Total advance looked good but it looked like advance was coming in to fast. Distributor came out of running car so assumed it was in good order. Pulled it apart and found the advance springs had been messed with and were not working correctly. Pulled spare distributor apart and made one good one. Another weekend done and another problem fixed....

You can always go this route:





Yes, those are throttle body fuel injection tucked inside what appears to be a 40IDA3C Carb. Just add a microsquirt module and you get all the appearance of a carbed car with all of the benefits of modern fuel injection.

https://store.jenvey.co.uk/throttle-body-ki...ottle-body-42mm

They also make 40IDF replicas that have FI inside.

Clay

[targa72e]

I have seen those. Nice if you can see the engine. Maybe not as good for 914.
I have these planed for future projects.

TWM 46MM planned for 3.5 Project, twin plug with Motec m130



Megasquirt, got with all the parts I used to build the engine in this thread. Not sure which project I will use this on.



Thinking about trying these on 2.7 Twin plug for my next -6 conversion.



RHD ITB's from X-factory look to be relatively affordable.

john

[targa72e]

My friend (also John) who is also going to Red Rocks is trying to get his 76 911 ready and one of the issues is a broken exhaust stud. I take some time to make a tool so he can drill it out on the car.



This was a quick build and not pretty but worked perfect to drill out broken stud. John lives about 45min from me so seamed like good opportunity to put on some miles. Decided to double check the axle bolts for tightness as this has bit me more than once where after initial torque, some gasket compression and bolts are loose. Sure enough several bolts on one axle were loose.

Car ran good on trip but idle and transition are still an issue. Started reading more carb tuning post and decide I might need larger idle jets. I did not have time to order so I ordered a micro drill set off Amazon to enlarge the ones I have, figure these should also work good to clean the tiny hole in idle jets as a starting point.

Week end of August 27th, Only two more weekend until I plan to leave. When I start checking idle jets and prepare to drilling larger I discover some have already been drilled larger and some are stock. I drill out the stock ones to match those already enlarged. I take the car out for a short drive, runs much better with all the same size jets and lean transition is gone. However car starts making loud drive train noise in rear. My first thought is I am about to lose a axle. Head home and jack up car. When I rotate wheel I can see the speedometer cable is jumping around. Rotate wheel some more and speedo drive is trying to rotate as well then some bad noise and everything is good. Speedo cable was dying, now broken. This has been a recurring problem (i am on my 4th). I decide I am not going to fix and will use phone app for GPS speedometer for trip. Now I can take the car back out for a highway drive.
Car runs good but cruise AF ratios are in the 11's, I little rich for a long trip. Idle AF is high 13 low 14. Decide to put 6 stock idle jets back in. This means starting over on carb tuning. Did I mention I hate carbs. Back to square one.
With new jets transition lean miss is back, highway cruise AF rations much better in the 13 range. Will leave as is for now.
Since I will leave my house and drive a 1/2 mile to interstate and then 8 hours of cruise the good cruise AF ratio seams like a good choice, once I am in Salt Lake I will put the larger drilled jets back in and switch out again for drive home.
Start hitting smaller projects.
When I got the car the ignition key did not match the rest of the locks. Might be nice to be able to lock car so I re-keyed the doors and the trunk. Now I can lock the car.
Another weekend done...

[targa72e]

Last weekend before leaving. Feeling pretty good that I will make it there and back. Will have plenty of spares just in case. Changed plugs, Changed Oil, triple checked torque on axle bolts, replaced fuse to get headlight working, put on new window wipers, cleaned misc junk out of car etc..
Only one glitch. Purchased and installed new Bronze shifter console bushing. When I went to drive the car could not get into 1,3 and 5th gear. Thinking wow I must have had a lot of slop with plastic bushing and need to re-adjust the shifter. Try as I did I could not get the car to go fully into those gears. Finally pulled boot of shift console on tranny to check what was going on. Shifter bushing was interfering with coupler. Flipped bushing and I have all gears again. Heading out Tuesday morning, working two days in Grand Junction then on to Salt lake.

john

[targa72e]

car is loaded and packed, full tank of gas (first time ever). Hopefully second to last post on this. Last one being I made it round trip and it was great.

too be continued....

john

[targa72e]

Made it to Salt lake with out any major problems.



Now just need to make it back, not as worried about that (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

john

[targa72e]

Final post. Back home. I made it!!



The trip ended up being about 1200 miles round trip including drives around Salt lake. Only had a few issues that were easily fixable.

While staying overnight in Grand Junction a heavy rain (very heavy) allowed water to get past the air cleaner seal. When I tried to start the car the next day it was hydo locked and would not turn over. Had to pull the plugs to clear water from cylinders. Water also got into carbs so had to drain float bowls. Once completed the car fired right up.

Just as we were getting ready to head out for our first drive the car died and would not restart. Issue was found quickly, fuel pump relay did not have good connection, quick wiggle and it was good the rest of the trip.

At the end of the first days drive the car was not running right. Investigation in hotel parking lot found that one carb was overflowing fuel. removed and cleaned float needle valves and all was good the rest of the trip.

In the end had a great time and meet a lot of new people. Maybe I need to re-title the thread to "it doesn't matter how you get to Red Rocks just do it!!!"

john

[Eric_Shea]

We're glad you made it John! See you next year.