Oil leaking from the oil cooler, Procedure question Options

[majkos1]

Come on people . . .

I would almost agree with you IF it were only the oil cooler seals leaking.

Personally, I’ve never seen an engine with only the oil cooler leaking and everything else in great shape.

There are so many other things that can be easily done when the engine is out

• Valve adjust with super easy access
• Easily replace spark plugs
• Inspect / replace hard brittle vacuum hoses
• Inspect engine wiring
• Front main seal if needed
• Rear main seal if needed
• Push rod tube seals if needed
• Inspect / replace clutch
• inspect engine mounts
• Inspect & replace throw out bearing and plastic pivot cup & fork sliders
• Inspect / tighten / replace alternator belt
• Inspect shift linkage bushings and coupler
• General engine clean up for more efficient cooling.

A reoccurring theme on this site is how leaky and unreliable these cars can be for some folks. Well yeah - if the engine hasn’t been pulled in 30 years and routine maintenance has been deferred because each owner was afraid to pull the engine what else would we expect?

This need not turn into Dirk Wright syndrome. But having the engine out is a good time to put eyes on things that would rarely been so easily seen and accessed.

I do agree with you. If the front main or rear main seal is leaking, clutch needs replaced, etc., etc.

But that wasn't the poster's question. The question was whether to pull the motor to replace leaking oil cooler seals. The answer to that question is no, it's a waste of time and effort.

Correct (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Classic "Since you're there"

almost like a airplane preventive check,

[930cabman]

Does the engine need to be removed to change the seals?

Any and all thoughts are appreciated!

Are you sure it's the oil cooler seals? There are other potential spots for oil leakage in the vicinity

[ClayPerrine]

Had to look up Dirk Wright. That one goes back a ways... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I actually found Dirk Wright on LinkedIn. He is a really nice guy and remembers 914s fondly.

[ClayPerrine]

For what it is worth, I have done it both ways.

I replaced the oil cooler, not the seals, the whole cooler in the parking lot of a hotel in Salt Lake City. It was NOT an easy job, but dropping the motor in a hotel parking lot 1200 miles from home was not an option.

If I am at home, in my garage, I will always drop the motor. It is a much better way to do it.

[Txbentleyboy]

Does the engine need to be removed to change the seals?

Any and all thoughts are appreciated!

Are you sure it's the oil cooler seals? There are other potential spots for oil leakage in the vicinity

I don't know. The shop that works on it for me said the cooler. What else should I suggest be looked at?

Thank and this forum!

[Superhawk996]

And the plot thickens. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

[emerygt350]

The oil pressure sender is right above it....

I figured out it was my cooler when I noticed it only leaked bad if the oil got hot and the valve opened the oil cooler.

[Superhawk996]

Don’t forget the possibility of leaking galley plugs (circled) or the gasket behind the oil filter (arrow)

All these look like leaking oil cooler seals from the bottom.

The idea that you’re having to scope out these possibilities (both of the repair procedure and where it might be coming from) doesn’t bode well for the shop

[Txbentleyboy]

Don’t forget the possibility of leaking galley plugs (circled) or the gasket behind the oil filter (arrow)

All these look like leaking oil cooler seals from the bottom.

The idea that you’re having to scope out these possibilities (both of the repair procedure and where it might be coming from) doesn’t bode well for the shop

We live in NASCAR country. Way out in country. The shop I use is a VW bug restoration/repair specialist. They do some very good work. He's been good about educating me but has told me he is not a specialist in type 4 motors.

This is why I come to you guys now and then for advice and it is greatly appreciated.

[scallyk9]

Don’t forget the possibility of leaking galley plugs (circled) or the gasket behind the oil filter (arrow)

All these look like leaking oil cooler seals from the bottom.

The idea that you’re having to scope out these possibilities (both of the repair procedure and where it might be coming from) doesn’t bode well for the shop

My oil leaks turned out to be leaking oil galley plugs after first suspecting the oil cooler. After pulling the motor apart, inspection revealed the culprit to be galley plugs in the vicinity of the oil cooler. The leaks had shown up after an oil change done by a garage at the request of a body shop and the sump had been overfilled by 1.5 quarts. We replaced nine oil galley plugs with threaded plugs. In view of this, I recommend pulling the motor for a thorough inspection of the area when you replace the oil cooler. Less work in the long run.

[Superhawk996]

Going back to Emery’s post, make sure shop has done UV dye trace in the oil before you let them tear stuff apart.

I also have an engine that had an oil pressure sensor hole that was stripped out and leaking profusely. It looked just like an oil cooler leak from below.

Bottom line, make the shop prove to you that they know where the leak is originating before they start charging $ for dropping an engine. When I first posted, I was under the impression you were the one doing the work and that labor is essentially free.

[GregAmy]

...I think that if you remove the sheet metal at the front of the engine, you may have enough space to remove the fan, alternator, and fan housing...

When I was tidying up the engine tin and stuffing the drivetrain yesterday, I gave this a closer look. I'm more convinced that you can remove the front engine tin and you *might* have enough space to get the fan housing off while it's still in the car.

One screw underneath, six(?) screws on top, and the front tray/tin should lift out. Working underneath you can get to the fan bolts, which upon removal then allows you to remove the housing.

I may try that next time I need to work on the front of the engine. Though it only took me a couple hours solo to remove the drivetrain (I have a lift).

GA

P.S. Of course, if you try that method, you would be wise to go ahead and replace the front crank seal and o-ring behind the hub (torque to 23 ft-lbs with blue loctite!) and even give reasonable thought to re-sealing the oil pump...

[Jack Standz]

[/quote]

Going back to Emery’s post, make sure shop has done UV dye trace in the oil before you let them tear stuff apart.

I also have an engine that had an oil pressure sensor hole that was stripped out and leaking profusely. It looked just like an oil cooler leak from below.

Bottom line, make the shop prove to you that they know where the leak is originating before they start charging $ for dropping an engine. When I first posted, I was under the impression you were the one doing the work and that labor is essentially free.

Totally agree. And from the first post, it seemed you knew it was the oil cooler seals that were the problem. Since that may not be the problem, more/better diagnostics are in order.

When I tested our new 2056 motor last year, it had good oil pressure, so installed it. Turns out it had an oil leak in the same area, but turned out to be the oil pressure sending unit. It was a little loose and was an easy fix to tighten it from the top side - no engine dropping required (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif).

In addition, even though the shop isn't a type iv specialist, if they know VWs, they know type iv oil coolers. The type iv oil cooler is a pretty simple part and is really just a VW "dog house" cooler.

[GregAmy]

Useful data point: you can get to the front of the engine with the drivetrain still installed. You can even get the fan housing off, too.

I tried it this afternoon when I realized I had botched up the CPS toothed gear install during my crankshaft repair. I was able to remove the front lower sheet metal and gain access to remove the fan and flip the toothed gear around. That process was certainly easier and faster than re-removing the drivetrain.

It's a bit of a PITA especially if you have nice surround seals, but I made it work. I took off the driver's side shortie piece down first, then leveraged around the longer bit upward to get it off.

BTW, removing that shortie bit will be on my standard checklist for R&R the alternator. It makes things a TON easier. - GA