Sale Pending - My purchase of 9140431482, Just facts; no spin or opinion Options

[mb911]

With a brush or spray bottle use this after you get it pretty clean. Let it sit for a good 30 minutes then wipe with water to neutralize. Then once dry quick Scotch brite , wipe, epoxy primer.

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Same stuff as Ospho

The critical step is to ensure it’s neutralized after application.

I’m not sure what directions are on the bottle Ben is recommending (local big box stuff). Ospho implies that you can paint over it - this is true for an outdoor metal railing using an oil based paint but has zero applicability to automotive epoxy / urethane finish.

Must be rinsed / neutralized prior to primer and dried thoroughly.

Yes for parts that are getting epoxy just brush or spray bottle on, let sit for 30 minutes, soak up extra with rag, spray water on then wipe and repeat the last step. My whole car was done that way and I do all my steel parts I manufacture the same way prior to powder paint.

[Rufus]

@ Karl R @mb911 Not sure how this’ll work out, but I foresee working in patchwork fashion in stages; possibly completely prepping some before others.

Thanks for your ideas! I’ve been considering Evaporust, but concerned how easy it is it to neutralize & wash sufficiently in the floorpan without drainage. Just wash down with wet towels or cloths several times, then rust preventative or metal prep depending on work schedule? I welcome any experience with that.

Curious about the same things re Kleen Strip metal prep, mb911.


Ooooops … sorry Ben / Superhawk, you addressed this while I was typing. Cheers

[Mikey914]

Spray bottle and vacuum from a shop vac. suck it up as you spray it down.

[technicalninja]

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I keep a dedicated "wet" vac ready to go.

Absolute best way to clean and dry out carpet and padding that has been SOAKED in antifreeze due to a heater core leak. You have to drench the floor in water a couple of times to dilute the coolant. PIA

Sometimes I'll go through a couple of "drain the vacuum" procedures during a carpet cleaning so I'm moving 5-10 gallons of liquid.

It would work great for tub flushing.

[mountainroads]

we sure sold the previous owner a bunch of parts

That would be the owner before me.

- MR

[mountainroads]

This photo is from July 2013. Don't know where it was taken.

That would be in my driveway after I got the new wheels and tires. Please note this is BEFORE any restoration efforts were started.

- MR

[mountainroads]

Those floors are pristine.

>>
I'd also consider taking down anything with personal information on it from your post. That's really not cool.

I hate seeing these types of posts. They don't break rules, but they do nothing to forward the forum or the love of these cars. And they tend to irrevocably destroy possible roads forward between the poster and whoever they have beef with.

<< !

Zach

@Zach, I appreciate your suggestion, but am not opposed in this case as I have nothing to hide.

- MR

[mountainroads]

I had to take a break from posting to this thread for a day to get my blood pressure back under control.

I empathize with Rufus' frustrations. I too had disappointments along the way. It took much longer (7+ years) and cost a lot more than I expected. I got tired of writing multi-thousand dollar checks without getting the car. I was particularly annoyed that the car didn't run quite right when I got it back from Chris's - the carbs popped under partial load. So, exasperated and deeply disappointed, I took the car to Akers for diagnosis. Turned out to be carburetor jetting. Ironically, I embarked on this restoration because I knew it was better to do my own restoration than buy somebody else's. I would know what had and hadn't been done, even if more expensive. Or, so I thought.

Here's the major shop expenses. There were plenty of others. Please note these are only expenses directly related to restoral. No initial PPI, subsequent service/maintenance, etc. Rufus has all the receipts, but I still have the Quicken report for reference.

Rillos: $60K+
Classic Interiors: $10K+
Chris's: $20K+

I realize this is no guarantee of quality workmanship, but doesn't quite strike me as a "budget conscious" restoral effort. What I don't understand is all of the niggling problems he's had since. All the lights, horns, wipers, headlight motors, etc. worked when I sold the car. The car was driven multiple times back and forth between Seattle and Central Washington without drama. I thought it was pretty well sorted by the time it was sold. Then I remind myself these are 50+ year old machines that technically qualify as antiques.

I take no responsibility for the Rothsport inspection or subsequent work. The PPI was done in my garage and I don't have a lift. $1000 doesn't seem too out of line for a 4+ hr. drive each way. Although a hassle, I would've willingly taken the car to any Seattle area shop of Rufus' choosing for a more comprehensive inspection, had Rufus requested. Personally, I would've installed a front oil cooler as the factory did instead of the rear trunk setup chosen if I was convinced additional cooling was warranted. But, it wasn't my car at that point and I figured Rothsport knew what they were doing. I have no idea what changes that introduced.

Did I try to present the car in the most favorable light? Of course I did. But that's far different than knowingly selling a defective car.

Original FS post here: http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=346147 It's an interesting read with plenty of pictures and a few videos. Please note the (post #34) snip:




Unfortunately, this car is now forever tainted by this very public story. Any prospective buyer who does any digging at all will find this. I have a friend who plans to sell his beautiful mid-80s Mercedes with sub-9K miles. I previously suggested he try to sell it private party, since I've had favorable experiences doing so. No longer. I've since advised him to use a broker instead.

I'm very interested in learning what's discovered with the floorpan. If truly bad, then the two well-respected Seattle area shops actively involved in the restoration, plus his PPI provider, failed both of us miserably.

- MR

[Karl R]

I've used a bunch of things for rust removal: battery acid, prep and etch, muradic acid, Evaporust.... Pretty much since the start of the iron age folks have been peddling rust removal miracles, so lots of choices. I'm kinda new to the Evaporust, but so far I am super impressed. Not only is it effective at getting back to shiny bare metal, but it is easy on eyes, hands, paint, plating, etc. It removes only rust. It is Ph neutral so nothing to neutralize after. I just rinse and prime. Where you cannot make a puddle, like you can here, I soak a bit of micro fiber cloth, put that on the rust and cover with plastic for a few days.
On the other hand, don't bother with their rust prevention product, RustBlock. It IS non oily, which is nice, but it does not seem to give very solid rust prevention.

[Superhawk996]

Unfortunately, this car is now forever tainted by this very public story. Any prospective buyer who does any digging at all will find this.

- MR

I honestly don’t feel this car is tainted.

I am amazed by the $$ put into this car by both parties and how it seems the only winners are the shops that appear to be charging top dollar for workmanship I’d call sort of meh - just phoning it in. It’s not outright bad workmanship- it was just super expensive for what was provided to each of you. Likewise not entirely surprised that issues were created by subsequent work after the sale. Each time a car is messed with it’s all to easy to screw things up that were fine before. This happens sometimes in my home shop. The difference is I don’t get the bonus of billing the customer for the subsequent fix.

I really do appreciate both sides of the story and the names of the shops involved. It seems to me that far too often we tend to sweep stuff like this under the rug under the guise of not wanting to air dirty laundry. But given the $$ that have been pumped into this car, it think it is enlightening to see what is going on within the Porsche community. Since I do my own work, Thankfully, I don’t see it first hand. It makes me believe in doing my own work even more because then I control the end result.

Though I’ll never be in a position to buy this car, I haven’t read anything here that would be prevent me from considering it if I were to hit the lottery.

Here’s to you gentlemen, thanks for sharing the story and the background on this car.

[mepstein]

I don’t think it’s tainted. It’s now just very accurately represented. I’m sorry about all the trouble the current and past owners have gone through but it should be a really nice car once it’s finished up.

[wonkipop]

I don’t think it’s tainted. It’s now just very accurately represented. I’m sorry about all the trouble the current and past owners have gone through but it should be a really nice car once it’s finished up.

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50 year old cars.
its a wonder they are still here!
karmann built them to disappear (russian steel from ukraine i believe?)/
every 914, but especially sixes deserves every bit of care it can get.

i think most of the first owners drove the things like they stole them and left them parked out in the rain and snow because.........next years model was going to be even better and their six would just be an old beater bomb. (little did they know they were gonna be doomed to a two decade run of water cooled alternatives to the stockbrokers pumped up beetle).

[Mikey914]

Regards of if there were shortcomings, there are concepts that should be noted.
Don’t create conflicts of interest, that way if a PPI is not through, there’s no financial reward. At least it won’t be salt in the wound.

[mountainroads]

>>

I am amazed by the $$ put into this car by both parties and how it seems the only winners are the shops that appear to be charging top dollar for workmanship I’d call sort of meh - just phoning it in. It’s not outright bad workmanship- it was just super expensive for what was provided to each of you.

<<

To be clear - I never had an issue with any of the work that Akers Porsche did. I would recommend them to anyone. Mark and I went for an extended test drive after he rejetted and adjusted the carburetors. He knew the story and wanted to be SURE I was happy with the way the car was running before I took it home.

Likewise, the work done by Steve Shepp (Classic Interiors), now gone.



- MR

[930cabman]

I don’t think it’s tainted. It’s now just very accurately represented. I’m sorry about all the trouble the current and past owners have gone through but it should be a really nice car once it’s finished up.

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50 year old cars.
its a wonder they are still here!
karmann built them to disappear (russian steel from ukraine i believe?)/
every 914, but especially sixes deserves every bit of care it can get.

i think most of the first owners drove the things like they stole them and left them parked out in the rain and snow because.........next years model was going to be even better and their six would just be an old beater bomb. (little did they know they were gonna be doomed to a two decade run of water cooled alternatives to the stockbrokers pumped up beetle).

Exactly, our "entry level" (at best) are now 1/2 century and most original owners didn't care when they were new. Just the fact many are rolling the roads is a testament the way I see it.

[mountainroads]

I sometimes ask myself if nagging Chris towards the end to get the car back contributed to the fact it wasn't running right after he was done with it. I stayed in touch with the previous owner, visited him occasionally, and kept him updated on the progress. The sad fact was he was in declining health and I wanted him to see the car, literally before it was too late. IMO, that's still no excuse for letting me have the car with incorrect carb jetting. Quite possibly, they were never corrected to match the new cams.

Two additional data points:
1) The crests on the center caps were hand painted by Harvey Weidman's wife. I thought they were a nice touch.
2) The dashboard is original to the car and in excellent condition. Steve Shepp would never have let it leave his shop, if subpar compared to the new carpeting and reupholstered seats and backpad.

Below is a picture taken outside the PO's assisted living home when he first saw the car again. I gave him a framed picture to keep. He hung on longer than I expected, but is also now gone.





- MR

[Rufus]

Quote from 5/31/2020 Advertisement:
“- New Elgin 306/288-106 camshafts.”

Service invoice provided after the sale. Started with used Delta cams and had them reground:

[wonkipop]

I sometimes ask myself if nagging Chris towards the end to get the car back contributed to the fact it wasn't running right after he was done with it. I stayed in touch with the previous owner, visited him occasionally, and kept him updated on the progress. The sad fact was he was in declining health and I wanted him to see the car, literally before it was too late. IMO, that's still no excuse for letting me have the car with incorrect carb jetting. Quite possibly, they were never corrected to match the new cams.

Two additional data points:
1) The crests on the center caps were hand painted by Harvey Weidman's wife. I thought they were a nice touch.
2) The dashboard is original to the car and in excellent condition. Steve Shepp would never have let it leave his shop, if subpar compared to the new carpeting and reupholstered seats and backpad.

Below is a picture taken outside the PO's assisted living home when he first saw the car again. I gave him a framed picture to keep. He hung on longer than I expected, but is also now gone.





- MR

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/first.gif) photo. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[Cairo94507]

I think it is wonderful that you took the car back to visit the previous owner for him to see and have some great memories before he passed away.

[rhodyguy]

90k spread over 3 businesses is a lot of money to me. A LOT!