Calafornia Road Charge Options

[73-914]

Sounds like a great way for EV's to pay their fair share

[SirAndy]

https://dot.ca.gov/programs/road-charge
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PS: Y'all get exactly one warning: Do NOT make this thread political.

[Optimusglen]

edit - nevermind, found the other page with FAQs.

[windforfun]

This reminds me of the old NY State Thruway. Your toll was based upon how many exits you drove past. They even took personal checks if necessary.

[nathanxnathan]

I think a better idea would be to make weight of a vehicle play a bigger part in how much it costs to register a car. It directly affects how much impact the car has to the integrity of the road. Also, the heavier the car, maybe the more safe you are, but it makes others less safe. Cars getting bigger, heavier, taller makes driving a normal car more difficult. I generally can't see anything backing out of a parking space in my daily VW Golf on account of every other car here being an suv. Cars are just getting bigger and bigger every generation. The new electric trucks coming out are absurdly heavy.

[Montreal914]

Without getting political, it makes sense to me; you use, you pay.

But, shouldn't this also be based on the weight of the vehicle, or is that portion handled on the yearly registration fee?

EDIT: I guess Nathan you replied to my question.

WOW if we want to get into the size of cars trucks/SUV, this will turn ugly (and political).

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https://www.theverge.com/2020/10/19/2152295...afety-oversized

[Steve]

They have been talking about this in CA for quite awhile. We pay several dollars per gallon of gas in taxes. EV's pay nothing. Hopefully they will you use this to even things out.

[mb911]

That’s sounds like a good thing.

[flipb]

Virginia implemented something like California's Road Charge a few years ago. They assume 11,600 annual miles driven and calculate the equivalent gas tax that would be paid by an ICE vehicle getting 25mpg.

I agree with the idea of making it based on miles + vehicle weight. Not sure about other states but Virginia already has a mandatory annual inspection of all registered vehicles (except historics). It would be pretty easy to record the odometer, and then mail a bill based on miles driven * GVW.

Also, somehow I can't help but laugh that a forum of 914 enthusiasts all agree that vehicles should be taxed based on gross weight. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif)

[burton73]

From California’s own Road Charge site


Best Bob B

[VaccaRabite]

Hah. If adopted nationally I could see this absolutely killing EV sales almost overnight.

And if they REALLY feel that every vehicle under 10,000lbs does the same damage... I don't see how my 6000 pound 4Runner could possibly do less road wear then a Honda Civic.

Zach

[technicalninja]

The interesting data would be the percentage of road wear the under 10 crowd creates VS the above 10K.

Does it step up dramatically at a higher weight?
Might it will be a multi-tiered rate that is the fairest...
How did they test this?

The transport crowd will pitch a fit!

Not really fair to have the Electrics pay nothing however...

Glad someone else has the job of coming up with this stuff.

Not one I want...

[nathanxnathan]

From California’s own Road Charge site


Best Bob B

Just a little research on that as it makes no sense, "The standard calculation is that road wear goes up as the square (conservatively; fourth power is well documented for heavy trucks) of the weight. So the Hummer (9500 lbs) causes about 100 times the damage of a Prius (3000 lbs). Even at the conservative second power, it causes 10 times as much damage. Heavier vehicles of course also require that bridges be built for heavier loads, increasing their built cost as well as maintenance."

according to this articlehttps://gettingaroundsac.blog/2023/12/16/road-charge/

Hard to swallow that it would be the same. Easier to believe 10x or even 100x imo

[wonkipop]

the govt. just attempted such an EV levy in my state down here.
it was challenged in court successfully by the hybrid vehicle owner lobby and has been withdrawn.

the govt. messed up its levy. it applied the same levy to hybrids as it did to battery EVs.
hybrid lobby proved the formulas were unjust as they did not account for fuel excise they already paid when they filled their tanks covering road use.

battery EV owners got a reprieve.

but its coming for sure. just that bureaucracy down here needs to exercise a bit more brain power in terms of fee scale.
the first go at it was fixed as part of registration fees. odometer declerations were required as part of annual road registration fee.

[SirAndy]

Hard to swallow that it would be the same

I think what they are really trying to say here is that anything under 10k pounds is peanuts compared to a loaded semi truck (40k-80k).
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[wonkipop]

Hard to swallow that it would be the same

I think what they are really trying to say here is that anything under 10k pounds is peanuts compared to a loaded semi truck (40k-80k).
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yeah

road crews are always out fixing the left hand lanes of the interstates here.
(read that as right hand lane in your mirror world).
they get pounded into destruction by the semis.

as an aside the cops down here are pushing for bikes and electric scooters to also pay a road use registration fee. ok they are pretty light weight, but the argument is that portion of the road dedicated to bike lanes etc still requires maintenance.
the rise of the dedicated bike lane has opened new cost obligations and cars can't use it.

[Montreal914]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) What next, sidewalk and pedestrians? Dogs?

[914_teener]

I have a 2022 Maverick registered and plated in CA. It weighs 3,600 lbs and gets 29mpg regularly.

It has a bed on a unibody chassis. Since it has a bed in is a commercial vehicle.


If I'm not using is as a commercial vehicle I shouldn't have to pay the extra tax.


I agree with a use tax but it's gonna be hard to justify to commercial tax when you have a general driving use tax.

You should pay what you use and that goes for the electricity too.

IMHO.

[wonkipop]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) What next, sidewalk and pedestrian? Dogs?

easy to do. tax your shoes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

dogs are taxed already down here. no tag = fine - even if leashed.
its illegal for a cat to be outside the house --- period.

jokes aside.
the bike lane one is interesting and probably has merit.
bike lobby pushed very hard for the dedicated network of bike lanes rapidly expanding across the city. roads everywhere have decreased in capacity to accomodate.
and serious numbers of bike and scooter users now commute using them.
so.......some kind of charge even nominal is perhaps appropriate.
everybody walks on the pavement. you pay your regular tazes for that.
the question of the road and its users is perhaps more particular.
for local councils there is the question of revenue loss from less on street carparking too.
so its getting kind of complex down here.

[Shivers]

its illegal for a cat to be outside the house --- period.

Wow, not here, they're all over the place. My neighborhood keeps them inside at night or the coyotes and the great horned owls get them.