Another help me get this engine started! Thread Options

[emerygt350]

Hmmm.. any old regulator that you can set to the right pressure will work until you can get the right one. You want 29psi I believe. Regulators don't go that often but I guess it's possible.

[Literati914]

Update on my ‘no fuel past the FPR’ issue:
I bought and installed a new FPR and of course that did not change anything, still no fuel getting past the regulator.

Next I thought I’d test the 3-wire plug on the side of the distributor (to/from the trigger points). Here’s a picture of what I found there.. one wire is broken. I believe this is the ground wire, a guess based on the fact that I could not get either of the plugs at the injectors on the driver’s side to light up with a test light set up.

[Literati914]

The wires to that plug were all feeling a bit weak, so I cut them (will have to go back and do a proper fix later) and added very small female spades. It’s plugged in and doing nothing (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)

I get no illumination at the test light on any of those three wires when attempting to start the engine. Any ideas on what to check next?

[Literati914]

I pulled the trigger points but see nothing that looks off, not sure I’d know it if I saw it though (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Literati914]

Another view

[emerygt350]

Did you check continuity on the points?

[Superhawk996]

Update on my ‘no fuel past the FPR’ issue:
I bought and installed a new FPR and of course that did not change anything, still no fuel getting past the regulator.

Well you blew right past that one.

What’s the chance that you have two bad regulators? Not sure what the definition of “new” is. New aftermarket. New (to you) 50 year old used part. NOS in box part. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Gotta get to the bottom of that issue. Plumbed properly?

[emerygt350]

Update on my ‘no fuel past the FPR’ issue:
I bought and installed a new FPR and of course that did not change anything, still no fuel getting past the regulator.

Well you blew right past that one.

What’s the chance that you have two bad regulators? Not sure what the definition of “new” is. New aftermarket. New (to you) 50 year old used part. NOS in box part. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Gotta get to the bottom of that issue. Plumbed properly?

I bet it's plumbed backwards

And what ECU is in it?

[Literati914]

Update on my ‘no fuel past the FPR’ issue:
I bought and installed a new FPR and of course that did not change anything, still no fuel getting past the regulator.

Well you blew right past that one.

What’s the chance that you have two bad regulators? Not sure what the definition of “new” is. New aftermarket. New (to you) 50 year old used part. NOS in box part. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Gotta get to the bottom of that issue. Plumbed properly?

Brand New in a box Delphi unit, it's supposed to be the direct replacement for the bosch unit on a type IV:
https://www.amazon.com/Delphi-FP10545-Regul...d=YzXYmxN5IFC9H

There's not a lot of info out there regarding weather the fuel gets past the PFR if it doesn't stay pressurized w/ a continuous pulse from the injectors (especially with a completely new fuel system that's never seen a fully pressurized condition). I surmised that it might take the injectors firing a few times to get enough pressure built up to move past the FPR, but I don't know. The FPR seem(ed) like the easy button - but then again, I don't think my trigger points are firing, as chronicled above.

BTW - I'm using an Airtex E8445 fuel pump which seems to be a common recommendation for fuel injected 914s, I got it used but the guy says he only opened it to test and kept it as a back up. So it's basically new for what it's worth. There is fuel before the PFR as mentioned.

[Literati914]

..
I bet it's plumbed backwards

And what ECU is in it?

Can't be plumbed backwards because of the way it mounts to the stand/tin. The ECU is the original one for this 1.7L , I can get the numbers off it tomorrow.

One thing that I thought about but haven't tried yet on the new FPR, is to back the pressure screw way off and see if I get fuel past it... I did however do that on the original FPR and got nothing. I guess I'll try that after looking at the trigger points.

[Dave_Darling]

Can't be plumbed backwards because of the way it mounts to the stand/tin.

Hoses can be switched easily. Don't be quite so certain about that... I think one of my early diagrams had the FPR connected backwards, so if you followed it....

--DD

[Literati914]

Can't be plumbed backwards because of the way it mounts to the stand/tin.

Hoses can be switched easily. Don't be quite so certain about that... I think one of my early diagrams had the FPR connected backwards, so if you followed it....

--DD

Mine is installed like in the following picture (not my actual car), it would take some trying to get it wrong, I’d think. Maybe if the stand was twisted and the hoses were extra long (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

[Spoke]

still no fuel getting past the regulator.

The regulator on the return path of the fuel? Doesn't fuel go:

From tank >> pump >> injectors >> regulator >> tank ??

So no fuel coming from the regulator should mean much fuel pressure before regulator or a blockage in the system?
Or lack of fuel pressure from the pump?

What is the fuel pressure on the test nipple?

Found this picture on pbander's site.

[Literati914]

still no fuel getting past the regulator.

The regulator on the return path of the fuel? Doesn't fuel go:

From tank >> pump >> injectors >> regulator >> tank ??

So no fuel coming from the regulator should mean much fuel pressure before regulator or a blockage in the system?
Or lack of fuel pressure from the pump?

What is the fuel pressure on the test nipple?

Found this picture on pbander's site.

Thanks for the pic, but yes the return path is not ..returning. I'll double check the fuel lines under the tank and report back - my feeling on that up 'til now is that I wouldn't have fuel past the cyl#1 area if they were kinked .. but that could certainly be a misconception.

[emerygt350]

People manage to route it backwards where the pump hits the regulator first then goes into the rails.

Have you checked the pressure on the rails?

[VaccaRabite]

..
I bet it's plumbed backwards

And what ECU is in it?

Can't be plumbed backwards because of the way it mounts to the stand/tin. The ECU is

Oh yes it can. I know it. I've DONE it.

I chased a no start issue on my car for months that ended up being that I had the supply line and the return lines swapped at the fuel tank after I had epoxy coated my tank.

Once I swapped the lines at the FPR - boom! Instant start up!

Did I feel dumb? Yes. Did I do a happy dance anyway? Also yes.

Almost 10 years and another whole engine later, the lines are still "wrong" at the tank. I had done something like putting the sock on the wrong nipple inside the tank when I rebuilt the tank. Since its coated inside, I don't want to unbolt any fittings on the tank and risk fouling the epoxy. So that's just the way it is now.

Swap your fuel lines at the pressure regulator. See if it starts. And take a moment to put a little gage on the feed side fuel hose after your pressure regulator. Its a dumb regulator. Just a bolt, a plate, and a spring. Actually knowing your pressure is very helpful.

Zach

[Literati914]

You guys certainly have me second guessing my fuel system routing - I'll double check and report back - Thanks!

[ctc911ctc]

Me too - I had my '73 apart in 1986 for some reason while I lived in Redondo Beach, when it was back together, the car ran but not well, I was young and brought it to a dealer (Vasack) with all types of theories, when I got it back the bill was tiny. Stated: Fuel Lines on pump in wrong positions.

Very Humbling

..
I bet it's plumbed backwards

And what ECU is in it?

Can't be plumbed backwards because of the way it mounts to the stand/tin. The ECU is

Oh yes it can. I know it. I've DONE it.

I chased a no start issue on my car for months that ended up being that I had the supply line and the return lines swapped at the fuel tank after I had epoxy coated my tank.

Once I swapped the lines at the FPR - boom! Instant start up!

Did I feel dumb? Yes. Did I do a happy dance anyway? Also yes.

Almost 10 years and another whole engine later, the lines are still "wrong" at the tank. I had done something like putting the sock on the wrong nipple inside the tank when I rebuilt the tank. Since its coated inside, I don't want to unbolt any fittings on the tank and risk fouling the epoxy. So that's just the way it is now.

Swap your fuel lines at the pressure regulator. See if it starts. And take a moment to put a little gage on the feed side fuel hose after your pressure regulator. Its a dumb regulator. Just a bolt, a plate, and a spring. Actually knowing your pressure is very helpful.

Zach

[Literati914]

I’m gonna check at the pump soon, will report back.

My fuel routing is less than ideal because I have 2 separate reducing points as well as an “increase” area too, believe it or not. The reason for this? I’lll try to explain… it’s an early car, so has 1 large and 1 small diameter tubing in the tunnel (they match the nipples from the tank). The Airtex FP has a small input size, so I used a reducing filter before it to get me there… then the line has to increase again to feed the large tunnel tubing (Tangerine Racing 180 degree fitting).. then it has to reduce again for the fuel rails (metal reducing filter).

I was just trying to complete the routing. I didn’t think that would create a severe drop in pressure but if you guys figure that’s my FPR issue, let me know and shoot me some ideas on the easiest way to change it for the better.

Here’s a quick drawing of my routing :

[Literati914]

Ok, nobody has an educated guess on this - that actually makes me feel better! Maybe it wasn't so loco after all (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I will admit though that I'd like to clean up the size changes.. I feel like that could only help. I have a little plan, that would probably be better. The later cars went to both small diameter lines, so in theory that probably helps with pressure all the way to the back (they did it for a reason). I don't care to switch out the larger diameter line if I don't have to.. so let me ask this first :
Would there be any problem with using the larger diameter tunnel line for the return fuel?