Subaru transmission installation, Now it's a reality!!! Options

[J P Stein]

A little correction on the 300hp sti, it's a 2.5. TT jdm 2.0 was between 240 -280 depending on which body style and tranny and year and on higher octane fuel in japan. A 2.5 sti with forged internals, bigger valves, ported heads, cams, springs and retainers, bigger injectors, bigger rotated turbo external wastegate and standalone ecu with a good air cooler is gonna knock the heck out of 9k probably if you assemble and tune it yourself. In other words no labor.

Thanks for the info. The 2.0L is still the target....this keeps the total car weight down ...class rules & all. I've found an outfit in Canada (via Ebay) that is selling them.
Even your estimated price is way cheep compared to 400 bhp Porsche engine prices and none of those fit the class requirements/needs for a light car.
Jerking out/selling the 6 and all the accoutrements makes your price about a wash.....just a lot of work. An RX7 turbo motor is also a possibility.....but I hate the sound of the things and torque is not their strong point. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

[DBCooper]

Charlie, are you sure about those US spec horsepower numbers? I've always understood that the 04-06 2.0 liter STI's were 300hp/300ft/lbs torque. I just looked it up and that seems right. Then they didn't change those ratings with the 2.5 engines. Am I misunderstanding something?

J P, could I make a suggestion? You're free to ignore it, of course, that's fine. Why don't you see what a stock 2.0 STI motor will do before you start breathing on it? The conversion is a lot of work anyway to get things right, and I think you may end up be more competitive with that BMW than you think. Don't forget that the STI motor is already a lot lighter than your six, which will probably change your suspension/handling too. The suggestion would be to start out learning with a pretty much stock engine, see where you are and what breaks, then go from there. Only one big change at a time.

[J P Stein]

Charlie, are you sure about those US spec horsepower numbers? I've always understood that the 04-06 2.0 liter STI's were 300hp/300ft/lbs torque. I just looked it up and that seems right. Then they didn't change those ratings with the 2.5 engines. Am I misunderstanding something?

J P, could I make a suggestion? You're free to ignore it, of course, that's fine. Why don't you see what a stock 2.0 STI motor will do before you start breathing on it? The conversion is a lot of work anyway to get things right, and I think you may end up be more competitive with that BMW than you think. Don't forget that the STI motor is already a lot lighter than your six, which will probably change your suspension/handling too. The suggestion would be to start out learning with a pretty much stock engine, see where you are and what breaks, then go from there. Only one big change at a time.

While I agree with your "one big change at a time", 300 ponies is not enough.
The weight issue is moot. We already have to ballast up to XP.....lighter (I don't know enough to debate that) means more ballast. Folks that haven't picked up a Porsche 6 always over estimate it's weight ...my son picked up the 2.7 & loaded it onto the engine stand...he's strong, but only had half of it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

The 2.8L effective size (2.0L X 1.4) means more ballast.....22 lbs. If it is a good deal lighter there is always E Mod. How much does the Subi motor weigh... with all the shittage? I figure the oil to water cooling change will be about a push. Actually mounting the engine appears to favor the 6 weightwise.....a lot of ughknowns at present.

I don't do things half assed. It will be a challenge or it wouldn't be any fun.

[Porcharu]

From my blog - The Suby engine is 236 pounds plus 18 pounds for the fuel supply and injectors, alternator and bracket plus the throttle body. This is for a 2005 2.5 NA so add a bit for the turbo stuff. This also includes the stock heavy flywheel and pressure plate, so you could easily loose 15-20 pounds.

[J P Stein]

Humm.....E Mod. The 2.5L Subi is a lot easier to come by.....a 3.5 L equivalent....
1800 LBS minimum *with driver*. The XP & E Mod top dogs are both tough but E Mod looks like the better chance.

[charliew]

Paul my son has a 04 suby sti domestic model. It is 2.5 with 300 hp and torque but that is at the crank not the wheels. The nasioc guys say about 240 -260 at the wheels stock at 17 psi boost stock. Even the newer wrx's are 2.5 but now the sti has dual avcs (both cams are controlled, the 04 only had the intake variable control) I'm not sure if the wrx has that, it may be like the 04 sti. I'm thinking the wrx has a lower power rating even though it's a 2.5. Now the japanese domestic market sti stuff may have been 2.0 in 04 and 300hp. I'm not up on late jdm subys. I remember they have a twinscroll turbo for faster spooling and spin higher, maybe because they are 2.0, but I don't remember the numbers. I am sure though that factory numbers are stated at the crank. My son has over 13,000 above the new car price of 32k in 04 in his car and it's making over 400 at the wheels but it is not the original motor, it's on a stand in my garage for him to keep if he ever wants to go back to stock. I'm not going to start over but I think the turbo suby six is the way to go in the 914. I'll be happy with what I have already accumulated to go in mine.

Oh yeah the suby stock cast iron exhaust manifolds are really heavy some weight can be saved there also.

I also see where megasquirt now has a patch board that will make the ms a more or less plug and play for a usdm suby engine harness. 425 for the ecu with the right female connectors for the suby harness. I didn't see it but I bet that it will also cover the suby ignition and the ford edis and the add on 36-1 wheel won't be needed.

Oh yeah the stock 04 sti also runs out of stuff about 6800, that will affect the race characterists as far as rpm range, it will spin further but looses power, 6800 is the stock good shift point. The sti was a six speed so it will be different depending on the tranny used also.

I think the 05 turbo legacy 5spd awd tranny has the best parts but it may be geared too low for a light 914 but it will have the strongest stock gears to date.

[Heater Guy]

Here is my set up for the cable shifter

Did you use a hydraulic or cable for the clutch?

[jimkelly]

per the 914 suby wiki ...
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...&hl=outback

i think i'll be going (like bigkat did) with the sub cv at the trans side, 911 axle machined for it, and 911 cv/flange/hub on the wheel side since i have 108mm flanges and hubs in my garage already.

http://blindchickenracing.com/How_to/CVJoi..._joints_101.htm

** see this ** suby to 930 108mm cv flanges : ))
http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.ph...80&start=15

http://www.subarugears.com/

jim

[matthepcat]

Jim,

I have a set of bus axles and CV's (with RH adapters), and have converted to 944 & machined 914 axles.

I don't think there is a dimensional difference between the bus & 944 CV.

That being said, you could always use a 100mm 911 stub axle with a 911 hub and spacer.

By spacer I mean this (Disregard the stub axle in the picture...that's a 944 stub):

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/img412.imageshack.us-11125-1321637094.1.jpg)

[matthepcat]

Then you would use the spacer between the hub and bearing:

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/img51.imageshack.us-11125-1321637317.1.jpg)

[Porcharu]

My machinist has two more sets of the 'magic flanges' left over from the last run. Make me an offer and I will see if he is willing to let them go.
Steve

[blitZ]

Are these the spacers needed to connect 911 stub axles to 944 CVs? I'll take them. How much?

[Porcharu]

No - take a look at my blog 1st picture is of the flanges for sale.

[jaxdream]

The spacers are used to adapt the later SC hub centric flange not the earlier 911 wheel hub . The 911 100mm flange will work with both wheel hub flanges , just have to put a spacer ( 5mm ) on the Sc flange before you install into the bearing. Then after that you have to choose if you want to run 108mm CVs or 100mm Cvs. BTW the 911 stub has the same spline as a 944 ( 951 part number ) , you could use the 951 stub as pictured before , it would stick out towards the tranny that amount that is pictured , or haver it machined off , either way it will seat up against the bearing . Check the classifieds here , I have 108mm and 100mm wheel stubs for sale if you are in the market for that part of the equation.

Jack

[blitZ]

If I have the 944 CVs and the early 100mm 911 stub axles, I don't need the 5mm spacer? Still trying to figure this out. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

The spacers are used to adapt the later SC hub centric flange not the earlier 911 wheel hub . The 911 100mm flange will work with both wheel hub flanges , just have to put a spacer ( 5mm ) on the Sc flange before you install into the bearing. Then after that you have to choose if you want to run 108mm CVs or 100mm Cvs. BTW the 911 stub has the same spline as a 944 ( 951 part number ) , you could use the 951 stub as pictured before , it would stick out towards the tranny that amount that is pictured , or haver it machined off , either way it will seat up against the bearing . Check the classifieds here , I have 108mm and 100mm wheel stubs for sale if you are in the market for that part of the equation.

Jack

[pcar916]

If I have the 944 CVs and the early 100mm 911 stub axles, I don't need the 5mm spacer?

Correct

[jaxdream]

You only need the 5mm spacer if you use the SC ( later ) type wheel hub with the hub centric ears on it , if you are using early ( 69- 73 ? ) wheel hubs no hub centric ears you're ok as they mount in the same bearing as 914 wheel hubs. Yu could use the 911 100mm CVs if you use 911 axles spaced at the needed length being you are using a subie trans . The 911 100mm CVs use a larger ball size than the 944 Cvs 5/8" vs 3/4 or 7/8 " , I'll have to measure again as I have 944 CVs and 911 CVs at 100mm. Plan onusing the 911s becaues I have the CVs ( 100mm ) and axles that are good , just got to get 3/4"" spacers for the trans side as I also have the course spline 100mm trans stubs for a 901 / 914 trans . BUT my trans part doesn't fit your subie trans . Get them there magic flanges while you can , the 911 parts are easier to get , and more common.

Jack

[jaxdream]

Can you show a pic of the wheel hub that you are going to use ??? and if it's a redrilled 914 hub to 5 lug setup , the 911 stub won't work as the 914 and 911 used a different spline count / size .

Jack

[blitZ]

It's a 911 hub and already on the car.

Can you show a pic of the wheel hub that you are going to use ??? and if it's a redrilled 914 hub to 5 lug setup , the 911 stub won't work as the 914 and 911 used a different spline count / size .

Jack

[jaxdream]

You good to go then , get the 944 CVs , proper length axles , trass flanges that will accept what cv you decide , install and Goooo !!

Jack