Shall I say... 3.6?, my conversion thread ... Options

[SirAndy]

old clutch ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)

can you see the burn-marks? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-179-1185423026.jpg)


fuzzy closeup: (IMG:style_emoticons/default/icon8.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-179-1185423047.jpg)


burned the pressure plate as well: (IMG:style_emoticons/default/barf.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-179-1185423089.jpg)


what's all that dust falling out of there? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sheeplove.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-179-1185423131.jpg)


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif) Andy

[SirAndy]

new clutch, pressureplate (thanks paul! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/pray.gif) ) and custom ringgear:

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-179-1185423229.jpg)


custom tool i made to remove/install the ball socket for the clutch lever pivot. 14mm socket that needs to be ground down to fit.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-179-1185423295.jpg)


and installed (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_pokal.gif) :

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-179-1185423324.jpg)


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) Andy

[SirAndy]

new 993 combo gauge. now i got the right gauge for the oil sending units. also hooked up the "check engine" light ...


wired and ready to go:




fuzzy closeup of them warning lights:




(IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif) Andy

[IronHillRestorations]

Very cool. But don't you have too much power with that 3.6?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[thesey914]

So Andy, you now have the late push (pull?) type clutch with flat flywheel and bolted on starter ring? Is that the only mod you have to make, repositioning the pivot ball? Any mods to the cable?

[SirAndy]

So Andy, you now have the late push (pull?) type clutch with flat flywheel and bolted on starter ring? Is that the only mod you have to make, repositioning the pivot ball? Any mods to the cable?

no, it's not a 911 style pressure plate. it works just like the stock 914 PP, so no modifications needed at all.

i only had to add a shim to the pivot ball for throw adjustment on the lever ...
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/bye1.gif) Andy

[jonferns]

Very cool. But don't you have too much power with that 3.6?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

you can never have too much power...right? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) -JON

[Tobra]

Very cool. But don't you have too much power with that 3.6?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

you can never have too much power...right? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) -JON

I never heard someone say, "I wish it had less power."

Mark Donahue said if you can leave two black marks from where you start accelerating to braking zone you have enough power. You put 300 hp in a 1800 lb car, I would expect it to be interesting.

Oh yeah, Merry Christmas

[scotty b]

Finally we see the reason behind Andy's fuzzy pics. Lay off the juice man, you've got the jitters !!

[iamchappy]

I too have some clutch holding problems as horsepower builds with the turbo, I was thinking of trying a Kevlar clutch before having to step up to a stage 3 pressure plate, Andy are you using a stage 2 pp? if not what........

[SirAndy]

I too have some clutch holding problems as horsepower builds with the turbo, I was thinking of trying a Kevlar clutch before having to step up to a stage 3 pressure plate, Andy are you using a stage 2 pp? if not what........

KEP Stage II
http://www.kennedyeng.com/porsc_pp.htm


So far, so good. Supposedly good for ~350HP and ~275 ftlb of torque ...
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) Andy

[iamchappy]

The Kep stage 2 wont hold mine, mostly in 5th, Kevlar clutches supposably can hold
more horsepower so that maybe the option i will try.

[PRS914-6]

I'm no expert but there is a big difference in a disk built to last (Kevlar) and one that is built to take torque. I suspect the Kevlar is indestructible but may not offer the best coefficient of friction to prevent the slippage.

Call Brett at Kennedy Engineering and ask about the race fabric that has more metal in it. The disk will be a little harder on the flywheel and pressure plate but the additional metal fibers make it grip better without adding a heavy pressure plate to prevent the slippage. It's what I used on mine with a stock 915 pressure plate and it does not slip at all under anything I throw at it.

[iamchappy]

I've talked to Brett at Kennedy his move is for me to send him my pressure plate and tweak it to something like a stage 2.5 or go to a 3
I have also talked to Renegade who use the Kevlar clutches exclusively on there V8 conversions because they say they can hold over 30% more HP.

I'm surprised your stage 2's can handle the torque, i would of thought that your 3.6's would have more torque than my 3.1 turbo. The turbo engine has more horsepower than you have with the 3.6's but i dont think it has as much torque.

This is from the Renegade website:

CLUTCHES
Infinite hours of testing are invested into our products. In the quest for more power, we burned up clutches, roasted flywheels, and tested the abilities of our best pressure plates, all in the name of a "streetable" clutch package. Many unsuccessful combinations were attempted before we came up with the right solution.

We found that the Porsche clutch disc, using a Kevlar facing, works extremely well and remains very acceptable for a daily driver. The Kevlar friction material increases holding power 30-40% over standard materials.

KEVLAR CLUTCH DISCS
Kevlar is one of the newest editions to the vast array of materials used to surface a clutch disc. While we offer just about any material for any application, the Kevlar, in most cases, is the best all around choice for a combination of street and track use.

NOTE: Proper break-in is a must with this material. Misuse or abuse during break-in will cause chatter and limited holding characteristics. Up to 500 miles of very mild engagement and limited compression braking is required to "seat" this material. Once it's properly broken-in, the overall performance will be second to none

[PRS914-6]

Actually, my pressure plate is stock (915) but I don't know how it compares to a Kennedy Stage 2 901. When I talked to Brett I told him I did not want a heavy feeling clutch and wanted no part of a heavy duty pressure plate. I find that very annoying in a street car.

He steered me to this special fabric with more metal and claimed it would do the job and far exceed organic disks. Even with my posi 915, I can stand on it without a problem with a chipped 3.6. I'm pretty happy with it. They rivet and glue the fabric on a disk and it results in a slightly thicker disk and they have to machine the pressure plate a little to make up for it.

Brett would know better than I if the disk he sold me is better or worse than Kevlar for torque capacity. I would pose that question directly to him.

[iamchappy]

Brett doesn't like Kevlar disc's mostly for the break in, if not done right there easy to burn up self destruct and wont hold at all.
if done right i believe there suppose to hold better are less abrasive and last longer than organic.

I have talked to a couple of guys running them in there huge horsepower turbo 911's
who swear them.

Renegades Kevlar 9" clutch sells for under 200.00 and i think it's worth a try, if i get one, i will post my observations this Spring or Summer
when i get back on the road.

[-JR-]

Andy, any chance you can elaborate on a couple things?

I can't find anywhere that you talked about mounting the flywheel pickup. It looks like you have some special bracket and then cut the trans bell housing to accomodate it. What happend there?


The drive axles...
You mentioned you used 944 CV's, what year / type? (S2/turbo/standard)

"Early 911 hubs" Any idea of the part number or exact years and
did these fit the 914 hub bearings?

Dito for the stub axels

When you say "modified" 914 shafts, what did that entail?

"later 911 flanges" would that of come from a 915 trans?

Thanks!

[SirAndy]

any chance you can elaborate on a couple things?

I assume you're talking about the sensor on the flywheel. In which case the bracket is stock 993. All i did was to notch the 901 bellhousing in the right place for the sensor.

As for the 944 axle conversion, there's a thread with all the details in the classics forum ...
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif) Andy

[PRS914-6]

An FYI....The conversion flywheel is smaller than a 993 making the sensor gap too big unless you machine the bracket for the sensor to drop deeper...see pictures

[SirAndy]

An FYI....The conversion flywheel is smaller than a 993 making the sensor gap too big unless you machine the bracket for the sensor to drop deeper...see pictures

Mine worked just fine ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

I set the gap to the factory specs and the adjustment on the stock bracket was more than enough. No machining needed.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) Andy

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads/post-179-1181192469.jpg)