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> PMS bar mount failure, the picture
Van914
post Apr 27 2006, 03:50 PM
Post #221


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Wow,
12 pages ont this subject. I bet PMS hasn't sold as many bars as people who have commented. I have one I bought new from PMS 2.2 with no problems. My friend also runs one on his PCA-GT5s 914 with a 2.2 and 180 rwhp. No problems for 5 years of abuse.
just my thoughts,
van914
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Mueller
post Apr 27 2006, 04:03 PM
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QUOTE(Van914 @ Apr 27 2006, 02:50 PM) *

Wow,
12 pages ont this subject. I bet PMS hasn't sold as many bars as people who have commented. I have one I bought new from PMS 2.2 with no problems. My friend also runs one on his PCA-GT5s 914 with a 2.2 and 180 rwhp. No problems for 5 years of abuse.
just my thoughts,
van914



I'd like to know what people are doing for transmission mounts with the bars that have and have not failed. Are rubber mounts used on far ends of the bar that attaches to the body??
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Brad Roberts
post Apr 27 2006, 04:13 PM
Post #223


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QUOTE
It was on a car with a hotted up 3.0, and the failure was cracking on one of the mounting ears that bolt to the engine.


RJ uses a stock 911 mount with ears welded to it. Now, where did it break?

I'm now beginning to think that the PMS bulk head mount could break also. He uses the exact same material for the front of the engine (plate steel) as he does for the bar.

Has anyone learned anything?

It is funny. Trek just calls me on all of this..then asks me if I have seen the thread yet? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/clap56.gif)


B
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brant
post Apr 27 2006, 04:52 PM
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I agree the PMS bulkhead is built of the same strength materials.. but I think that the forces on it are quite different.

having that underbar reach behind the motor and take the force/twisting of the motor rocking forward back exerts more force than the simple up/down (without leverage) that the bulkhead gets.

I'm certainly no engineer, but I haven't yet heard of a single PMS bulkhead failure (and there is a lot of ancedotal about bar failures)

The factory bulkhead is small and puny, but works pretty good for what I theorize to be the same reasons.. less leverage, less force

brant
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Kerrys914
post Apr 27 2006, 06:37 PM
Post #225


Dear, the parts I just sold paid for that part ;)
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Bad welds will fail both of the POS bars... If the quality control at POS is not there or he called in sick that day...The welds may not be what they should be and they will fail.


RJ mount all the way..Get-it and forget it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/clap56.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)
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grantsfo
post Apr 27 2006, 06:43 PM
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QUOTE(carr914 @ Apr 27 2006, 01:44 PM) *

OK you guys are scaring me. Where do you buy the RJ mount and how much?

T.C.


Give Rich a call. He is a great guy and passionate about 914-6 conversions. I could tell he has spent a lot of time thinking about how to produce a strong mount that is relatively installation freindly. Certainly not as easy as the PMS quick mount bar, but the piece of mind is worth it to me.

He impresses me as businessman with integrity. Thats tough to come by these days.

$471 later I have a mounting system, 911 engine mounts and piece of mind!
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Jeroen
post Apr 27 2006, 07:45 PM
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QUOTE(brant @ Apr 28 2006, 12:52 AM) *

The factory bulkhead is small and puny, but works pretty good for what I theorize to be the same reasons.. less leverage, less force

no engineer either, but as far as I can see, it's the center part that sees the most stress/leverage

the reason I think the stock /6 mount works is because it has a HUGE rubber block in it which will deflect and allow the engine to move
But my guess is that this only works with a small six and that a big torqy engine would rip or wear the rubber out pretty soon

The problem is not so much in how you mount the bar to the chassis, but how you mount the engine to the bar
IMO that's where the RJ mount wins in design over the PMS mount (bulkhead or quick bar)
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Trekkor
post Apr 27 2006, 10:32 PM
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This is prolly why I'm stubbornly trying to fix mine.

It wasn't welded...

Even with that it survived 20ish a/x's and 9 track days. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

I'll give it one more chance.


KT
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SirAndy
post Apr 27 2006, 10:36 PM
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QUOTE(trekkor @ Apr 27 2006, 09:32 PM) *

I'll give it one more chance.


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/slap.gif)

just don't hate me if i ever need to bring this thread back from the dead ...

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/w00t.gif) Andy "i told you so" Schmidt
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Trekkor
post Apr 27 2006, 10:51 PM
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2 points to consider:

1. This thread may never die.
2. If my bar breaks again do you really think I'll tell anybody. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/chairfall.gif)


KT
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Lou W
post Apr 27 2006, 10:56 PM
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(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer3.gif)
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jhadler
post Apr 27 2006, 11:13 PM
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QUOTE(trekkor @ Apr 27 2006, 08:51 PM) *

2. If my bar breaks again do you really think I'll tell anybody. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/chairfall.gif)


Only if no one else sees it happen.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

-Josh2
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lapuwali
post Apr 27 2006, 11:30 PM
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QUOTE(Brad Roberts @ Apr 27 2006, 03:13 PM) *

QUOTE
It was on a car with a hotted up 3.0, and the failure was cracking on one of the mounting ears that bolt to the engine.


RJ uses a stock 911 mount with ears welded to it. Now, where did it break?



It cracked halfway along one of the ears. Nowhere near a weld.
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DanT
post Apr 27 2006, 11:49 PM
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AKA "The rookie" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
[/quote]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)
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SirAndy
post Apr 27 2006, 11:51 PM
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QUOTE(Dan (Almaden Valley) @ Apr 27 2006, 10:49 PM) *

QUOTE

AKA "The rookie" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)


the jokes around here last longer than the threads they were born in ...
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/drunk.gif) Andy
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J P Stein
post Apr 28 2006, 07:27 AM
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Lemme see if I got this right........
You put a part on your car that was missing a weld?
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Trekkor
post Apr 28 2006, 08:45 AM
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Yeah (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

What's the big deal? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)



KT
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nocones
post Apr 28 2006, 08:55 AM
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QUOTE(J P Stein @ Apr 28 2006, 06:27 AM) *

Lemme see if I got this right........
You put a part on your car that was missing a weld?



Well it is a racecar after all... Welds would just add weight. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
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grantsfo
post Apr 28 2006, 09:28 AM
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Speaking of weight savings. In talking with Rich he indicated that I could cut out the standard 914-4 engine mounting structures which allows for better access to engine and cuts weight.

Trekkor, This is son of Frakenthread. ...It just wont die!
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DNHunt
post Apr 28 2006, 09:32 AM
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914 Wizard? No way. I got too much to learn.
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But what if you want to go back to a /4? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Dave
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