Suby-engined rustoration, 21-Sep-2024 update: more racing-related carnage! Options

[strawman]

Is your Subaru joint a tripod or a ball and socket type joint. The axles I did with the tri pod joint came in a inch shorter. Did you center the transaxle up with the swingarms or do you have the engine mounted farther foward for turbo. clearance???

Bob

I am using the far more common ball/socket joint, which appears to still be used by the WRX cars. I picked up a larger diameter tri-pod jointed axle at a junkyard a few months ago (typically only found in 2wd Legacy cars), but the maximum OD of the tri-pod joint is larger than the minimum of the Porsche 911 axles that I have. So I am going with the slightly smaller ball/socket joints. If these prove to be troublesome, I suppose I can go to custom axles with the larger tri-pod joints in the future.

EMPI sells replacement ball/socket and tri-pod joints. I downloaded the EMPI pdf catalog with these parts numbers; you can download a copy here:

http://www.empius.com/cvjoints.html.

Geoff

[BIGKAT_83]

Is your Subaru joint a tripod or a ball and socket type joint. The axles I did with the tri pod joint came in a inch shorter. Did you center the transaxle up with the swingarms or do you have the engine mounted farther foward for turbo. clearance???

Bob

I am using the far more common ball/socket joint, which appears to still be used by the WRX cars. I picked up a larger diameter tri-pod jointed axle at a junkyard a few months ago (typically only found in 2wd Legacy cars), but the maximum OD of the tri-pod joint is larger than the minimum of the Porsche 911 axles that I have. So I am going with the slightly smaller ball/socket joints. If these prove to be troublesome, I suppose I can go to custom axles with the larger tri-pod joints in the future.

EMPI sells replacement ball/socket and tri-pod joints. I downloaded the EMPI pdf catalog with these parts numbers; you can download a copy here:

http://www.empius.com/cvjoints.html.

Geoff

My transaxle is from a 2005 wrx and included the axles. These were a male stub tri-pod type that goes into the transaxle on the CV joint end. I think there is 6/7 different axles that can be used. I saw some axles on a closeout on rockauto and ordered these for the CV joints and they came as large ball and socket type. I'm going to have another set of axles made for someone and use these.

I've driven my car about a 1000miles now and have been very pleased with the transaxle. I even did a 5000 rpm drop the clutch power lanch to see what would happen....

Bob.......speed shiftin like a ricer

[strawman]

My transaxle is from a 2005 wrx and included the axles. These were a male stub tri-pod type that goes into the transaxle on the CV joint end. I think there is 6/7 different axles that can be used. I saw some axles on a closeout on rockauto and ordered these for the CV joints and they came as large ball and socket type. I'm going to have another set of axles made for someone and use these.

I've driven my car about a 1000miles now and have been very pleased with the transaxle. I even did a 5000 rpm drop the clutch power lanch to see what would happen....

Bob.......speed shiftin like a ricer

I need the female-type CV joints, as I'm using an OBX limited slip differential that has male outputs. Good to hear the transaxle has the oomph to take a 5000 rpm clutch drop!

[charliew]

My email with msn has been so slow I haven't been around for awhile. What is the tire patch size that did the 5k clutch dump? Kinda curious as to how much traction was applied to the tranny. 7,8,or 9 inch tires?

[Zaney]

As shown in the pics below, I have completed the air-to-water intercooler heat exchanger mounting, and wrapped up the mounting of the clutch master cylinder.

Here is a pic of the exchanger, which is actually an oil cooler that came out of a Ford Mustang. I'll be running 3/4" hoses back to the engine compartment, where a Bosch heater booster pump will ensure a good flow between the intercooler and the heat exchanger.



A good tip: the heater booster pump out of a mid-1990s BMW 5- or 7-series is the same unit used on the Ford Mustang Cobra that came with a factory air-water intercooler; tell the guy at the Pick-n-Pull counter that it is a "heater control valve" and you'll get it for under $10. You'll need a 6mm Allen wrench, 10mm socket, flat blade screwdriver and wire cutters (be sure to get the pigtail and the entire assembly so that it indeed looks like a heater valve!) and about 5 minutes to get one these. They're $100 new from various aftermarket vendors; I picked up four of them for under $40.

Next up are pics of the clutch master cylinder setup. This one came of of a 1993 Honda Civic hatchback, and has the same 5/8" bore as the one that came out of the Suby (a 1998 Forester)... so I'm confident it will mate up with the Suby clutch slave cylinder. The Suby unit has the reservoir incorporated into it, and it won't fit in the front bulkhead area; the Honda one uses a remote reservoir that I'll mount up by the stock 914 master cylinder reservoir. I built a custom "rod extender" to mate up the 914 pedals and the Honda master cylinder input shaft. Basically, I welded a 7mmx1.25 nut to a piece of 1/2" x 1.8" strap, and I'm using a 3/8" OD bronze bushing (which fits perfectly into the 914 clutch tab) over a 1/4" bolt that I welded to the strap to ensure smooth operation. The pictures don't show the outer bronze bushing/washer or the cotter pin that I'll add when I'm ready to install it "for reals." I've also included a pic of the brake and clutch master cylinders sitting comfortably side-by-side (the former is a 19mm unit from a 1976 911 that I scrapped, but I installed an ATE rebuild kit that I found on Ebay to freshen it up).







I still need to bend up and install the FedHill cunifer hardlines for the brakes and clutch systems, which I hope to mock up this weekend. I also hope to mock up the radiator and intercooler hoses. Stay tuned!

Anymore progress on this awesome clutch setup?
Especially the connecting strap portion.

Thanks,
Nate

[sawtooth]

Okay, so I just got another cocktail, and thought I'd take the time to add some more details of the trans teardown.

First up is a pic of the trans on my workbench, with the rear and mid case removed. As noted, you can see the Bremar coupler. You can also see one of the two trans side covers that provide the side-side adjustment of the differential/ring gear to get a good pinion / ring gear pattern.



Here is a pic of the mid case draining out the nasty-smelling gear oil. As part of the Bremar FWD conversion, you toss the rear case & guts, which originally housed the center differential. The shift rod is also shown in this pic.



Next is a pic of the guts of the trans.



Here is a side-by-side of the factory diff and the OBX limited slip.

Geoff, your suby trans rebuild is awesome, now that I'm thinking about a rebuild on mine I just went back and re-read this. Thanks for taking the time to get pics. I have a '93 5spd from non-turbo legacy in my car now and so far it's great, but I believe it needs some new bearings on the main shaft. My plan is to just pick up another and rebuild it to swap in at a later time. I would like to do the same as you, bearings, seals and the obx lsd. Can I ask where you bought your OBX? I see them listed on ebay for the '02-'06 wrx trans, but nothing for earlier years, non-wrx. I read somewhere the obx lsd should fit any suby 5spd trans but wanted to double check with someone who has done it. Also did you find a kit for your bearings and seals or did you just buy the individual pieces?
Thanks,
Dean

[strawman]

Sorry I haven't updated the thread in a while... too damn busy to even work on the teener much lately.

The OBX lsd is the same for all 5-speed pre-2006 transaxles, if memory serves. I bought mine on Ebay from a guy that provided the best price. He currently has the same price as when I bought mine OBX lsd.

Some guys on the NASIOC say you should replace the OBX case bolts with higher-grade bolts before you install it (D'oh! I read that too late), while other guys say it is a waste of time/money. My car is still not running, so I can't say if that is sage advice...

I've been watching your car build -- keep up the good work!

[strawman]

Been a while, and life's been in the way too much lately. But I've been able to work on a few things...

Below are some pics of the Suby Alternator/AC compressor mount that I modified to move the alternator toward the driver's side of the motor to allow 180 degree rotation of the intake manifold. I welded on ears to mount the alternator, and the belt lined up with the outer grooves on the crank pulley. Even though I hacked off a bunch of metal from this mount, it is still really heavy -- but it looks nicer after I powdercoated it and it should be rock solid.







I also rebuilt and powdercoated a spare pedal set. Here it is mounted alongside the new gas pedal from Mikey914. You can also see the powedercoated (but dusty) mount I built to raise the MR2 shifter.



The 911 axles that were shortened and resplined on one end by Dutchman Axles are in. You can see one of them on the workbench in the pictures above; they're comprised of cleaned/repacked 108mm 911 outer CVs and cleaned/repacked Suby Legacy Turbo inner CVs. I'll take a picture of the axles and post it here later. The SS fuel line from Tangerine are also in, and the modified fuel tank is mocked up, too. I hope to install the alternator, oil pump, water pump and cam belt/tensioners tomorrow. I'll then mock up the water hoses and finish up the fuel system in the coming days.

[strawman]

Haven't had time to update this thread in a while, but I have been squeezing in some time here and there. Also, my family gave me most of day in the garage today for Father's Day!

I found that the Vortech water-air intercooler won't work without some crazy hose routing, so I bought a Type 13 water-air intercooler from FrozenBoost as well as some aluminum tubing, silicone hoses & reducers, and t-bolt clamps. In all, that stuff ran about $275. Below is a picture of this work-in-progress. There's just enough room underneath for the air intake/MAF routing, but it is tight. I'll be running a plastic radiator fill-cap system from a Kawasaki Ninja 250 (it has 3/4" hose bibs to match my intercooler coolant system), as well as an electric Bosch water heater recirculation pump from a 5-Series or 7-Series BMW. If you pick one of these up, tell them it is a Heater Control Valve and you'll get it for less than $10; I picked up four of them over the past couple months to have spares.



I also finished up the front routing of the coolant hoses and IC hoses to the front of the car. I'm using 1.25" wired hardwall rubber Marine Exhaust hose to bring the chilled coolant from the radiator back to the engine, and 1" diameter to run the hot H2O from the engine to the radiator. It is a very tight squeeze to get the hoses over the top of the front aluminum suspension and under the steering rack (especially for the larger 1.25" hose), but this arrangement really maximizes ground clearance IMHO. As you'll see in the pic below, all of the hoses go through holes I cut in the front firewall. I picked up heavy-duty grommets online from Fastenal.



I'm using Gates 3/4" heater hose to/from the front-mounted heat exchanger and the IC. You'll see the routing in the picture below. You'll note that I haven't removed the rust and epoxy painted the front of the car yet; that area (and the rear of the car) were obscured by the rotisserie mounting bars. Something that is on my list of things to do...

[Mike Bellis]

Awesome! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif) I love air to water intercoolers. Frozen Boost has some cool stuff. I'm doing the same crap to mine but I'm using a Boxster or NACA duct in the rear quarters for fresh air.

[Britain Smith]

You gonna have it done by Thursday to bring it to the WCR (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Just joking, looks good! I got my icebox from Frozen Boost.

-Britain

[strawman]

My good buddy's family took off for LegoLand in San Diego for week, but he didn't want to leave the keys to his Boxster in the house for his 18 y.o. daughter to do dumb things with (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) So he told her he gave me the keys to do some maintenance on it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)

I wanted to see how his 17" wheels would fit and look on my car, so I took some time to investigate. The fronts are 205-50-17 on 17"x7" wheels with ET of 55. The rears are 255-40-17 on 17"x8.5" wheels with ET of 48. My wheels are BBS three-piecers in 16"x7" and 16"x9" with 205-50-16 and 225-50-16 (junk) tires. The Boxster wheel/tire combos are 39/46 lbs (F/R), while the BBS combos are 32/36 lbs. The diameters of the Boxster wheels are 25"/24.5" (F/R), while the BBS are 24"/24.5".

Below are some pics. First is my BBS rear tire/wheel, showing how little clearance exists between the tire and the flare lip. No spacers are used with my BBS wheels, nor is the alignment likely to be close to good. But there is a LOT of clearance between the tire and inner fender well -- on the order of 1" on the driver side and 1-3/8" on the passenger side.



Next up is the rear Boxster wheel mounted, followed by a pic of the rear inner clearance. All of the Boxster wheels were mounted using factory Porsche 944 spacers, which are about 3/4" thick.





Obviously, the tire to inner fender well clearance is too tight -- I cannot even fit my pinkie finger up there. No camber shims are mounted up right now, so camber is maximized.

Finally, here is the Boxster front wheel mounted up (again, with a 3/4" spacer) -- which is about perfect in terms of clearance with these wheels.



As you all know, it is getting harder and harder to find good 16" performance tires (much less period correct 15" tires). So I might look for some Boxster wheels and try to sell my BBS rims to a 930 enthusiast. What do you guys think?

[Mike Bellis]

Big O has some good 16's. I think your BBS look cool! I would paint the centers black if they were on my car. I have chrome ATEV's on mine. I've been thinking of a change but can't decide.

[strawman]

Britain, YEAH RIGHT! I wish I had the time to even give it a try! But work gets in the way, and my boss retired last month -- they gave me his job with only a small stipend increase. Gotta love workin' fo' da gubment!!! Either way, I'll be at WCR and can't wait to see your car. Hope my new camera doesn't burn out (hence the crappy Iphone pics above) snapping pics and stealing ideas (IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif)

Mike, I love the look of my BBS wheels and planned to powdercoat the centers black. But the offset on the rears is a little off, unless I machine the centers down to move 'em inboard a bit or find some different barrels. I'll need to talk to Al or Harvey Weidman to see what my options are.

[z31turbo]

Very impressive build, keep up the good work (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sunglasses.gif)

JF

[pktzygt]

I wonder how well the frozen boost heat exchanger and fan would if you put it in the rear of the car. I was thinking about a canister style muffler on one side and the heat exchanger on the other side. I can't imagine it would be any worse than the air to air intercooler.

Why did you turn the intake manifold? Just for ease of plumbing? I have the renegade mount, but want to avoid using their intercooler mess (there must be 6 feet of piping).

I also have a hot rod air system that I plan on installing. I think the intercooler heat exchanger, condenser and radiator in that little space might over-do it.

[strawman]

I wonder how well the frozen boost heat exchanger and fan would if you put it in the rear of the car. I was thinking about a canister style muffler on one side and the heat exchanger on the other side. I can't imagine it would be any worse than the air to air intercooler.

Why did you turn the intake manifold? Just for ease of plumbing? I have the renegade mount, but want to avoid using their intercooler mess (there must be 6 feet of piping).

I also have a hot rod air system that I plan on installing. I think the intercooler heat exchanger, condenser and radiator in that little space might over-do it.

Not sure about the heat exchanger in the engine compartment; I'd imagine you'd have to use auxiliary fans to cool it. Interesting idea, though. With that setup, I wonder if you'd take up so much "high" real estate in the engine compartment with the air/water intercooler and heat exchanger that it'd be a bear to get to any upper engine components from the top / engine lid. But I like the way you're thinking...

Yes, I turned the intake around for ease of plumbing. In hindsight, it definitely would've been easier to cut into the rear trunk... but I'm already losing so much of the front trunk with the radiator and hoses that I wanted to have some semblance of storage space in the rear trunk.

I might try to put A/C in my car someday, as it gets HOT here in the CA Central Valley. At this point, however, I'm just trying to get my car ready to roll on its own!!

[pktzygt]

Not sure about the heat exchanger in the engine compartment; I'd imagine you'd have to use auxiliary fans to cool it. Interesting idea, though. With that setup, I wonder if you'd take up so much "high" real estate in the engine compartment with the air/water intercooler and heat exchanger that it'd be a bear to get to any upper engine components from the top / engine lid. But I like the way you're thinking...

Yes, I turned the intake around for ease of plumbing. In hindsight, it definitely would've been easier to cut into the rear trunk... but I'm already losing so much of the front trunk with the radiator and hoses that I wanted to have some semblance of storage space in the rear trunk.

I might try to put A/C in my car someday, as it gets HOT here in the CA Central Valley. At this point, however, I'm just trying to get my car ready to roll on its own!!

I was thinking way back by the muffler and would have to use the aux fan for sure. Your engine must be sitting farther forward than mine. I was thinking about putting the intercooler on the passenger side top similar to where renegade puts it. and it would need two 90 degree bends to the throttle body and a couple other bends from the turbo inlet.

As of now the frozen boost 350hp kit or the 600hp kit are what I'm thinking about. It would depend on how much space is under the rear. I could probably do without that heat shield and free up some space.

You car is looking great by the way. Thanks.

[charliew]

The pictures of the boxter wheels are great. I have almost those exact wheels and tires but the rears I have are et 50's. I really appreciate the info, it will help alot on the fitment. I actually like the bbs better as far as looks but maybe it's because those are like the factory wheels on my gt fieros.

No matter what heat exchanger used it will only be as good as the air temp moved through it. The front is WAY better than the rear.

[pktzygt]

The pictures of the boxter wheels are great. I have almost those exact wheels and tires but the rears I have are et 50's. I really appreciate the info, it will help alot on the fitment. I actually like the bbs better as far as looks but maybe it's because those are like the factory wheels on my gt fieros.

No matter what heat exchanger used it will only be as good as the air temp moved through it. The front is WAY better than the rear.

I know, I know I was just trying to convince myself a pusher fan might do the job for something like an intercooler. Radiator, NO! I'll probably just give it a shot and let you know how it works. The worst thing that could happen is I have to move it.

OK, I'll stop Hijacking your thread now, Sorry.