 Heat exchangers for a six, Who makes the best? |
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| GeorgeRud |
 Oct 27 2008, 01:19 PM
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#21
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Advanced Member  Group: Members Posts: 3,725 Joined: 27-July 05 From: Chicagoland Member No.: 4,482 Region Association: Upper MidWest  |
The difficulty is that you should not weld the outer envelope to the tubes, but rather should have a flanged slip joint to address expansion issues. Ideally, you would have to remove the mounting flanges, make the envelopes in two pieces, assemble and weld/fasten the outer surfaces together. Having the dies to properly flange the envelopes to the tubes is expensive.
To do it right is a major undertaking not to be taken lightly. |
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| Johny Blackstain |
Oct 27 2008, 01:39 PM
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#22
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Walnut Elite Stratocaster player Group: Members Posts: 3,434 Joined: 5-December 06 From: The Shenandoah River Member No.: 7,318 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region 
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"Luftecnic", SSI distributors here on the East Coast, called back & confirmed there are no SSI exchangers for the six. Best looking ones are either Patrick or B&B. Only difference I can see is the O2 bunghole. GHL ones do not look very good. Photo order is Patrick, GHL & B&B.
Attached image(s)   
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| iamchappy |
Oct 27 2008, 02:45 PM
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#23
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It all happens so fast! Group: Members Posts: 4,893 Joined: 5-November 03 From: minnetonka, mn Member No.: 1,315 Region Association: Upper MidWest  |
Or the Hayword and Scott. Which might be a pain to get to the flange nuts.
http://www.haywardandscott.com/Details.asp...amp;category=16 I have the stock HE's but have found that they dont work all that great with the turbo. Attached image(s) 
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| Johny Blackstain |
Oct 27 2008, 03:30 PM
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#24
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Walnut Elite Stratocaster player Group: Members Posts: 3,434 Joined: 5-December 06 From: The Shenandoah River Member No.: 7,318 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
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QUOTE(iamchappy @ Oct 27 2008, 04:45 PM)  Or the Hayword and Scott. Which might be a pain to get to the flange nuts. http://www.haywardandscott.com/Details.asp...amp;category=16 I have the stock HE's but have found that they dont work all that great with the turbo. Whoa! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif) Those look fabulous!!! Thanks Chappy! Current exchange rate shows it to be $2351.13US + shipping. Patrick sells theirs for $2300 + shipping. I think I found my answer!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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| morgan_harwell |
Oct 27 2008, 04:09 PM
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#25
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Ha! Finally snuck up on a camera! Group: Members Posts: 126 Joined: 28-January 03 From: Santa Cruz Mtns., Ca. Member No.: 203 Region Association: Northern California |
I'm looking forward to an actual owner/user of these aftermarket SS/6 HE's to respond with what they think about:
1. amount of heat generated 2. fitment issues 3. worth the $$$ ? Should be quite a few aftermarket SS/6 HE's owners in the Pacific NW and Alantic NE. I've been driving a heater-less /6 for the past 20 years. A heater sure would be nice as the 914 and I get older. |
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| SirAndy |
Oct 27 2008, 04:25 PM
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#26
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Resident German Group: Admin Posts: 41,707 Joined: 21-January 03 From: Oakland, Kalifornia Member No.: 179 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(GeorgeRud @ Oct 27 2008, 09:03 AM) Unless something has changed, SSI has never made a stainless heat exchanger for the -6. His products are works of art, and should be used whenever possible, but I think he never saw enough of a market to tool up for the 914-6 heat exchangers, though many have begged him to! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) John at SSI never made stainless heat exchangers for the /6 ... The market for such a product just wasn't there ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bye1.gif) Andy |
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| SirAndy |
Oct 27 2008, 04:27 PM
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#27
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Resident German Group: Admin Posts: 41,707 Joined: 21-January 03 From: Oakland, Kalifornia Member No.: 179 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(GeorgeRud @ Oct 27 2008, 09:03 AM) The other option is to install an Eberspacher gas heater. It will keep you very toasty (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) again ... Eberspächer or Webasto gas heater is the way to go! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif) Andy |
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| number6 |
Oct 27 2008, 05:10 PM
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#28
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Member Group: Members Posts: 352 Joined: 14-September 08 From: portland, or Member No.: 9,546 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
QUOTE(Johny Blackstain @ Oct 27 2008, 12:17 PM) QUOTE(Lavanaut @ Oct 27 2008, 03:06 PM) What I was getting at is that, as others have already said in your thread ((IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)), SSI has never made heat exchangers for the /6, and I've read that the owner has stated explicitly that he will not ever make 914 exchangers again. I think Andy had a conversation about it with him at one time. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I seem to remember something along these lines myself. Also, I was wrong about GHL- they look nothing like the Patrick ones... quite shitty looking to be honest. Real a shame about the bad luck Perry had w/ B&B... best looking ones of the bunch. However in comparing the photos between B&B & Patrick Motorsports these look like they're made @ the same plant. This scares the (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stromberg.gif) out of me. The Patrick Motorsports is the Billy Boat. There's a B&B logo right on the page (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I have a set of B&Bs on my car, but unfortunately, it's not back from the shop, so I can't really comment. My expectations are not high, though, from what I've heard from other owners. The Hayward & Scott ones look promising - does anyone here have experience with them? |
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| Johny Blackstain |
Oct 27 2008, 05:34 PM
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#29
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Walnut Elite Stratocaster player Group: Members Posts: 3,434 Joined: 5-December 06 From: The Shenandoah River Member No.: 7,318 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
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QUOTE(number6 @ Oct 27 2008, 07:10 PM) The Patrick Motorsports is the Billy Boat. There's a B&B logo right on the page (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I thought so. Thanks. Hayward & Scott still have my vote. |
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| number6 |
Oct 27 2008, 05:43 PM
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#30
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Member Group: Members Posts: 352 Joined: 14-September 08 From: portland, or Member No.: 9,546 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
QUOTE(Johny Blackstain @ Oct 27 2008, 04:34 PM) QUOTE(number6 @ Oct 27 2008, 07:10 PM) The Patrick Motorsports is the Billy Boat. There's a B&B logo right on the page (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I thought so. Thanks. Hayward & Scott still have my vote. If you get a set, will you post a review/follow-up? I'm with you in thinking the Hayward & Scott may be the winner. Time to scour the forums... |
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| iamchappy |
Oct 27 2008, 05:52 PM
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#31
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It all happens so fast! Group: Members Posts: 4,893 Joined: 5-November 03 From: minnetonka, mn Member No.: 1,315 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
Johny, if you contact them ask if they can make them in larger diameter -1-5/8, 1 3/4 or the mm equivalent.
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| Johny Blackstain |
Oct 27 2008, 06:07 PM
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#32
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Walnut Elite Stratocaster player Group: Members Posts: 3,434 Joined: 5-December 06 From: The Shenandoah River Member No.: 7,318 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
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QUOTE(iamchappy @ Oct 27 2008, 07:52 PM) Johny, if you contact them ask if they can make them in larger diameter -1-5/8, 1 3/4 or the mm equivalent. Contacted today, waiting on a reply. Will ask about the larger diameters & if all goes well & I go for it, I will review. |
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| number6 |
Oct 27 2008, 08:24 PM
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#33
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Member Group: Members Posts: 352 Joined: 14-September 08 From: portland, or Member No.: 9,546 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
QUOTE(Johny Blackstain @ Oct 27 2008, 05:07 PM) QUOTE(iamchappy @ Oct 27 2008, 07:52 PM) Johny, if you contact them ask if they can make them in larger diameter -1-5/8, 1 3/4 or the mm equivalent. Contacted today, waiting on a reply. Will ask about the larger diameters & if all goes well & I go for it, I will review. I shot them an email as well. Will share any info I get back. Johnny, will you do same? I'm not going to ask them about the larger diameter if you already did. |
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| Johny Blackstain |
Oct 27 2008, 08:29 PM
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#34
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Walnut Elite Stratocaster player Group: Members Posts: 3,434 Joined: 5-December 06 From: The Shenandoah River Member No.: 7,318 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region
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QUOTE(number6 @ Oct 27 2008, 10:24 PM) I shot them an email as well. Will share any info I get back. Johnny, will you do same? I'm not going to ask them about the larger diameter if you already did. I did not ask about a larger diameter yet & yes I'll follow up regarding Hayward & Scott. I'm no longer interested in any of the other ones available. |
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| IronHillRestorations |
Oct 27 2008, 11:41 PM
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#35
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I. I. R. C. Group: Members Posts: 6,735 Joined: 18-March 03 From: West TN Member No.: 439 Region Association: None
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The Hayward & Scott have welds inside the heat shells. That's a big no-no.
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| number6 |
Oct 28 2008, 04:29 AM
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#36
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Member Group: Members Posts: 352 Joined: 14-September 08 From: portland, or Member No.: 9,546 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
QUOTE(9146986 @ Oct 27 2008, 10:41 PM) The Hayward & Scott have welds inside the heat shells. That's a big no-no. Perry, could you elaborate on this? |
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| number6 |
Oct 28 2008, 04:33 AM
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#37
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Member Group: Members Posts: 352 Joined: 14-September 08 From: portland, or Member No.: 9,546 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
QUOTE(Johny Blackstain @ Oct 27 2008, 07:29 PM) I did not ask about a larger diameter yet & yes I'll follow up regarding Hayward & Scott. I'm no longer interested in any of the other ones available. Well, apparently I did, indirectly. This is the response I just received, along with 2 larger photos, attached: Do you have 914 / 6 ? just wondered as you also mentioned a 3.2 but are you transplanting the engine into the 914 ?. As for supercharging the pipes would be far to small as standard ( 1.5" OD ) even for a 3.2 but if you go ahead with the order and mention at the time we would enlarge the pipes to accept the additional power ( 1.75" OD ). They are made from BS304 16 SWG through out and the heat exchangers work very well and we haven't had a complaints. :-) . lead time at the moment is approx 4 -6 weeks and if you can give me your full address we can get you a shipping price. Thank you Ian Reeve Manager Attached thumbnail(s)  
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| Root_Werks |
Oct 28 2008, 12:42 PM
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#38
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Village Idiot Group: Members Posts: 8,341 Joined: 25-May 04 From: About 5NM from Canada Member No.: 2,105 Region Association: Pacific Northwest
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QUOTE(morgan_harwell @ Oct 27 2008, 03:09 PM) I'm looking forward to an actual owner/user of these aftermarket SS/6 HE's to respond with what they think about: 1. amount of heat generated 2. fitment issues 3. worth the $$$ ? Should be quite a few aftermarket SS/6 HE's owners in the Pacific NW and Alantic NE. I've been driving a heater-less /6 for the past 20 years. A heater sure would be nice as the 914 and I get older. 1. Not much, low air flow 2. Good Fit 3. Nope BB Stainless Steel units. Really great quality, but $2k for luke warm air sucked. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) |
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| SirAndy |
Oct 28 2008, 12:52 PM
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#39
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Resident German Group: Admin Posts: 41,707 Joined: 21-January 03 From: Oakland, Kalifornia Member No.: 179 Region Association: Northern California |
QUOTE(number6 @ Oct 28 2008, 02:29 AM) QUOTE(9146986 @ Oct 27 2008, 10:41 PM) The Hayward & Scott have welds inside the heat shells. That's a big no-no. Perry, could you elaborate on this? I don't see any welds on the headers, only on the air box itself, which is OK ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) Andy PS: However, the air box itself is small and barely covers a small part of the headers. I just can't see this setup producing any real heat. PPS: And how are you supposed to tighten the exhaust nuts? I don't see any access holes. |
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| Root_Werks |
Oct 28 2008, 01:51 PM
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#40
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Village Idiot Group: Members Posts: 8,341 Joined: 25-May 04 From: About 5NM from Canada Member No.: 2,105 Region Association: Pacific Northwest
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There is a special wrench you can buy for VW/Porsche air cooled header nuts that would get those. I have one. Looks sort of like a funy "U" shaped wrench with a little "S" on the closed end of it. fits 13mm nut heads. It would get the above exhangers no problem.
I do agree with you Andy, I am not seeing much heat exhange area. Not even close to the factory units. I wonder if these produce any heat? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) |
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