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> 2.7 case guru, save/scrap
930cabman
post Feb 20 2021, 07:41 AM
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We are attempting fitting a 2.7 into our 1974 rustout hulk but have come across another hurtle. I have had a 2.7 kicking around for awhile and "assumed" we could go through it with new bearings/rings/..... and have a nice power plant. Not so quick there. The head stud issue is well known and I recently found when the magnesium cases are disassembled the crankshaft bores no longer return to a round/aligned condition.

I want to believe someone out there can get these magnesium cases in serviceable condition with good crank bores and good head stud bores.

thanks
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gereed75
post Feb 20 2021, 08:00 AM
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There are several places that do this. Ollie’s and competition engineering are two old standbys. They have relatively long lead times - 8 weeks or so. Contact them for details

Also prepare for $ - figure $2500 at least

There are some alternative places. You are in the Northeast. I have heard of a few places that do it, but do not have details. Hopefully someone else will chime in.

Suggest you post to Pelican engine rebuild forum. There are a lot more knowledgeable people listening on that board.

If you are doing heads, I recommend Craig Garret. 616-818-6629 He list often on Pelican. Also Anchor. https://anchoratlantic.com/ not sure either does case work

Just saw that you posted over on Pelican. Do not know the details of your head stud issues. Check out “homebuilt by Jeff” on YouTube. He went through a complete case salvage with major spigot bore issues using a really competent rebuild shop in LA. Assume large coin. you can pick up these case for fairly cheap if yours can’t be fixed (they will still need machined). Karl Hens down at Thoroughbred Racing in Corry PA has a shitload of them. He also rebuilds a lot of motors. He can answer any questions about machinists also.
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Luke M
post Feb 20 2021, 08:17 AM
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QUOTE(930cabman @ Feb 20 2021, 06:41 AM) *

We are attempting fitting a 2.7 into our 1974 rustout hulk but have come across another hurtle. I have had a 2.7 kicking around for awhile and "assumed" we could go through it with new bearings/rings/..... and have a nice power plant. Not so quick there. The head stud issue is well known and I recently found when the magnesium cases are disassembled the crankshaft bores no longer return to a round/aligned condition.

I want to believe someone out there can get these magnesium cases in serviceable condition with good crank bores and good head stud bores.

thanks



What did Larry say was wrong with your case? I've rebuilt a few mag case 911 engines. The machine work on a 2.7 isn't going to be cheap. Line bore, Deck height, case/head stud inserts, oil bypass mod, don't forget to do an insert in the Intermediate shaft case through stud as well. Not needed but dowel the mains too if you have the means.

Ollie's did all my 2.7 case machine work. I'd have to look for my receipt to see what it all cost but that was also 16 years ago.

Here's their price list : http://www.olliesmachine.com/uploads/ollie..._March_2019.pdf

I had all that done on my 2.7 case when I built it up to a RS. Pm or give me a call about it.
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mate914
post Feb 20 2021, 09:06 AM
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Your close to a lot of engine builders. Karl Hens is my choice.
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brant
post Feb 20 2021, 09:06 AM
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The machine work on a mag case adds 3k to the rebuild over an aluminum case

Thus should be calculated into the comparison to a 3.0/3.2 motor
Lots of places can do this work
But machine work is a paid skill
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mepstein
post Feb 20 2021, 09:29 AM
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Yea, unfortunately that’s the truth. Especially 2.7’s.
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Superhawk996
post Feb 20 2021, 10:30 AM
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Had all my 2.4L case work done by Ollies.

All part of working on mag cases. Really not a big deal.
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mb911
post Feb 20 2021, 10:46 AM
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QUOTE(Superhawk996 @ Feb 20 2021, 08:30 AM) *

Had all my 2.4L case work done by Ollies.

All part of working on mag cases. Really not a big deal.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Same here. Its just money right lol
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sixnotfour
post Feb 20 2021, 12:06 PM
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Has to be torqued together with the nose bearing , as it locates / centralizes the front half of the case .. for a proper main bore check...Unless it spun a main bearing ,, its repairable..
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930cabman
post Feb 20 2021, 01:38 PM
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QUOTE(brant @ Feb 20 2021, 10:06 AM) *

The machine work on a mag case adds 3k to the rebuild over an aluminum case

Thus should be calculated into the comparison to a 3.0/3.2 motor
Lots of places can do this work
But machine work is a paid skill


Exactly, why would we invest in a magnesium case when a 3.0 aluminum case appears more durable. Anybody have an extra 3.0 case in their back pocket.
thanks always
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Superhawk996
post Feb 20 2021, 02:10 PM
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QUOTE(930cabman @ Feb 20 2021, 02:38 PM) *


Exactly, why would we invest in a magnesium case when a 3.0 aluminum case appears more durable. Anybody have an extra 3.0 case in their back pocket.
thanks always



All depends what you want.

For me it's light weight and a period correct engine. Personally, I'm not interested in 3.x engines.

For anyone reading, please feel free to send me your "scrap" mag cases. I'll even pay for the shipping (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
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sixnotfour
post Feb 20 2021, 03:25 PM
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I have a small main bearing 3.0 case 6k..... Carefull, What you wish for....
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mepstein
post Feb 20 2021, 03:30 PM
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QUOTE(930cabman @ Feb 20 2021, 02:38 PM) *

QUOTE(brant @ Feb 20 2021, 10:06 AM) *

The machine work on a mag case adds 3k to the rebuild over an aluminum case

Thus should be calculated into the comparison to a 3.0/3.2 motor
Lots of places can do this work
But machine work is a paid skill


Exactly, why would we invest in a magnesium case when a 3.0 aluminum case appears more durable. Anybody have an extra 3.0 case in their back pocket.
thanks always


For me, once you add in the durability, power, fuel injection and final cost, the 3.2 makes sense. That doesn't mean it's the best. It just checks a lot of my wishes.

I still want an engine builder friend of mine to build me an aluminum case 2.0 hotrod that will rev to 8K+ and make glorious sounds. Just because.
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914forme
post Feb 20 2021, 04:22 PM
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You can always find another 2.2, 2.4, and 2.7L from somebody in running condition. PM me I have 2.7L on a stand right now I am planning on selling. Put it in and run it.

Why a mag case engine,

Conversion is easier, no special fly wheels, its a bolt in operation.
Mag case sound right
tad bit lighter
cheaper to purchase

Why go latter 3.0 - 4.0L
more power
perceived better reliability
easier EFI options from the factory
did I mention more power
Some people need it, some don't. 914 like any car a sum of the parts, and are an system unto themselves.

Just remember as your displacement increases your bank account decreases.

But then I fight this battle with every sports car I own. My Boxster build I am currently looking at a 3.8L 355HP engine thinking, yeah I need that. I have driven my Boxster for 1000 miles. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/screwy.gif)
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930cabman
post Feb 20 2021, 05:11 PM
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QUOTE(914forme @ Feb 20 2021, 05:22 PM) *

You can always find another 2.2, 2.4, and 2.7L from somebody in running condition. PM me I have 2.7L on a stand right now I am planning on selling. Put it in and run it.

Why a mag case engine,

Conversion is easier, no special fly wheels, its a bolt in operation.
Mag case sound right
tad bit lighter
cheaper to purchase

Why go latter 3.0 - 4.0L
more power
perceived better reliability
easier EFI options from the factory
did I mention more power
Some people need it, some don't. 914 like any car a sum of the parts, and are an system unto themselves.

Just remember as your displacement increases your bank account decreases.

But then I fight this battle with every sports car I own. My Boxster build I am currently looking at a 3.8L 355HP engine thinking, yeah I need that. I have driven my Boxster for 1000 miles. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/screwy.gif)


From what I can tell aluminum cases are generally more forgiving than magnesium, I am getting a 2.7 education for sure. Basically we are making the /6 conversion for added power, the finish product will not see a track or car show, but reliability is up there for a priority. The case I was hoping to use had previously been "repaired" with a timesert's and have since failed. I found a replacement case from Cali., when we unpacked it the head stud sockets in the case had also been "repaired". Both cases left little/no material left to work with.

Back at square 1, looks like I will be shaking the money tree a bit more
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gereed75
post Feb 20 2021, 08:52 PM
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Sorry that you had bad luck with the first and second mag cases. Not sure why that would be the case haha. There are plenty of sound mag cases available that can be built into perfectly reliable motors. 2.7 is pushing the limit in the cylinder spigot bore area in mag cases, but again, good unmolested cases are out there - $1500 - $2000 should get you a set. Between Karl Hens and Henry Schmidt you should have 50 or so to chose from

If I was building something to last 200,000 miles, make 225+ hp, and last the next 50 years, I would hunt down a 3.X aluminum case motor. If I want a fun build 2.2 - 2.7 that will last my lifetime of recreational use, a machined mag case, fully case saved, works just fine.

If I needed the ultimate small bore badass motor, break out the check book, find an early aluminum case and build away (as Mep suggested).

It is a matter of what will make you happy. My narrow body, mag cased 2.4 street toy makes me very happy. Not really worried that the cases will fail anytime soon.
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davehg
post Feb 20 2021, 10:12 PM
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My Ollie’s bill was closer to $4k for my 2.7, and it got all the works including oil bypass, decking, inserts, and a twin plug conversion. Running it with a Solex cam and Webers. The 2.7s are wonderful engines when built, as the make more HP than my stock 3.2 with a Steve Wong chip. I think their bad rap is due to the emissions crap which retained excessive heat and caused the warping. Shops would just torque down the heads and covers making things worse.

My 3.2 is sure fun with all the torque but the sound and performance of a 2.7 - can’t wait. Plus it looks way sexier than my 3.2.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i.imgur.com-21443-1613880734.1.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i.imgur.com-21443-1613880734.2.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i.imgur.com-21443-1613881178.1.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i.imgur.com-21443-1613881309.1.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i.imgur.com-21443-1613881309.2.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i.imgur.com-21443-1613881178.2.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i.imgur.com-21443-1613881178.3.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i.imgur.com-21443-1613881178.4.jpg)
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sixnotfour
post Feb 21 2021, 12:16 AM
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numbers matching


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rick 918-S
post Feb 21 2021, 06:14 AM
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QUOTE(sixnotfour @ Feb 21 2021, 12:16 AM) *

numbers matching


Wow that's cool!
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930cabman
post Feb 21 2021, 08:28 AM
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QUOTE(sixnotfour @ Feb 21 2021, 01:16 AM) *

numbers matching


I suppose it's true, "anything can be saved", but at what cost and what value. We have been successful in the historic building restoration business for many years and can fix anything, but often it is less expensive and will provide better long term value if we replicate with new materials. From what I understand Classic Porsche has new cases, now we are really digging into our pockets.
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